Kemerton 2015 Model - Issues

Hello everyone,

We are considering replacing our 2009 Symbol with a 2015 Kemerton we're looking at this weekend.  It's the 6m version rather than the XL.

We'd welcome any thoughts from Kemerton owners about issues we should be aware of, particularly build quality from that era, and any impressions of how the van works for you.  I'm not sure if the van we have in mind has a Whale submersible pump and/or a Whale Watermaster filling system, but those are examples of the things that seem to cause owners grief from what I read on the forum.  If it has a submersible then I'd seriously consider replacing it with an accessible Shureflow.

Another question, albeit a bit subjective ... are 3yr old Kemertons reasonably quiet while on the move, or do they constantly rattle and squeak in the back?

Finally, what are owners thoughts on the pros and cons of air ride suspension on a Kemerton.

Many thanks in anticipation for your views.

Tim & Ruth

Hi Tim/Ruth , Kemerton is a fantastic design ruined by silly build issues. Our van is 2014, had problem with water pump due to an intermittently faulty pump. Once I replaced it it has been 100% fault free as has the Whale fill system .I was unlucky and suffered a serious water leak due to quite frankly shocking build errors in the extractor fan in the roof of the shower cubicle.but this seems to be rare. More common is the microwave shelf which will need reinforcing as it drops due to weight and I found almost everywhere a lack of fixing screws in areas such as drawer runners, blind cassettes shelves etc. Easily fixed and should be done by now. 
   Kemertons like most other van conversions rattle on the road due mainly to the blind cassettes not being fixed adequately. Especially on the sliding door which a rear passenger will love you for. All are fixable and after many a happy hour repairing what shoshould  be done at build stage our van is now almost rattle free.All fixes have been covered if you do searches by myself and Charliefarley who was quite thorough in his approach.
          Air suspension is nice to have but in what is already a stiffly sprung van be careful with pressures as too hard a setting ruins any compliance in the springing  leaving you sitting getting your fillings rattled from your teeth! 
           If I can help with anything please pm me and I will be glad to  give you a true experience of ownership. As I say once sorted , a great layout. An easy mod for a few pounds allows 2 full single  beds without using cab seats so very versatile as it also allows a Warrick due type layout with 2 facing sofas. All the best...

just a point about the 'hard ride'...many dealers set these vans up with around 70+ psi (certainly in the rear)....this can only produce a rock hard ride...
both Michelin and Continental offer information about recommended 
ressures based on axle weights, mine run considerably lower than that mentiomed above.....
however, i believe that lowering pressures to make them more acceptable, can upset the TPMS....it may (should) be possible to adjust this in line with any new pressures...

bolero boy wrote: i believe that lowering pressures to make them more acceptable, can upset the TPMS....it may (should) be possible to adjust this in line with any new pressures...

It is - and it isn't!

Cymro started a detailed thread on this issue a while ago. The TPMS on the Boxer can be adjusted, but not by the owner. A main dealer can do it, but I think they charged Cymro forty pounds for the privilege!!

There was some confusion about their ability to "learn" a lower pressure after a few miles on the road, but I think this was found not to work in a number of cases.

No TPMS fitted on 2014 Kemerton, not sure about 2015 model. As you say playing around with tyre pressures can affect ride quality. Forgot to say 6M van has dedicated cuoboard for tv and very usable worktop over fridge. XL loses the tv cabinet and worktop above fridge is at a much higher level. Sofa is longer I think and gains an extra small cabinet to use the extra length.

Hi Tim & Ruth. Not had the same problems as Kaspian [or Charliefarley] with my 2014 build Kemerton. Though two road accidents with the van has cost me a fair amount of money. When I purchased the van as new in 2015 the main issue was trying to fit the infill cushions in between the larger sofa cushions, to make a double bed. It was difficult. Next I observed the metal runner under the single seat, next to the sliding door, and when the seat was laid flat, scuffing the side plastic panel, behind the front passenger seat. Under warranty the side panel was changed and the single seat re-aligned and all was well, including being able to fit the infill cushions in the gap to make the double bed. I’ve had a few minor problems since then, but occasionally with the expertise and assistance of members on the forum, these have been solved. For me it is a reasonably quiet, comfortable ride and like Kaspian says, the Kemerton has a great layout: this was the primary reason why it was chosen.
Mel

Thank you to everyone who shared their experiences on owning a 6m Kemerton - as always with this forum, folks are very kind with their time and extremely helpful.

We went to see the van today, found it to be excellent and did the deal, so hopefully will be collecting it in a couple of weeks.  I have a concern with the Whale filling system but will start a new thread on this.

Tim

symbol-bath wrote:Thank you to everyone who shared their experiences on owning a 6m Kemerton - as always with this forum, folks are very kind with their time and extremely helpful.

We went to see the van today, found it to be excellent and did the deal, so hopefully will be collecting it in a couple of weeks.  I have a concern with the Whale filling system but will start a new thread on this.

Tim

Hi Tim, good choice and good luck with your new van . Dont worry about the Whale filling system  it has been one of the few fault free things on our van that just does its job! I keep a 20l water container and if staying seversl days tend to fill via this as I can be filling fresh tank while emptying grey water using  a bucket. Simple solution that works for us. A/s van conversions  do not have massive water tanks so do tak e a bit more regular filling . If using the motorhome service points just use the blue flat hose supplied. Simples! Just remember to switch on internal power to the van to send power to the Whale filling system. Any questions jyst ask! 

yes, as Kaspian mentions above, the tanks are very small and this could be a pain for some...especially the tiny 40l waste tank...
compared to many other views ive seen on forums, we are 'extremely' thrifty with water....our large fresh tank lasts us 4-5 days if we are using the van shower, and double this if using site facilities...our waste tank has the capacity to deal with this through flow easily...
so, even with our sparce use, if showering in the van we would need to empty the grey tank every other day....a regular (annoying) trip to the MHSP?......or carry some sort of external waste water carrier like a wastemaster or fiamma.
others, less thrifty than ourselves might find themselves having to empty the grey tank every day...and filling every other day....
storage space in PVCs can be a bit tight, especially without the room under a fixed bed and finding somewhere for a wastemaster (or similar) in a Kemerton must be tricky/pain....and not very convenient for those who want to be off grid for a few days....
for comparison, the Adria Twin has 100l fresh tank and 90l waste tank...
irrespective of layout preferences, shouldnt all 'modern' vans be providing this level of 'life support' systems?

Symbol Bath has done the deal. Do you really have to tell him/her the shortcomings. As usual you know of better vans than AS , the A class you have is in a different league. Having read your previous posts on all subjects, I don't think you've had a van conversion so have really no idea of the storage ingenuity that van conversion owners come up with. Please stop telling us that we've all made huge mistakes and let us enjoy what we have

Paul, this thread is about 'issues'.....isnt it?
the small tanks sizes were mention by Kaspian, not me....im just seconding the point he raised....very small water tanks can become a pain for some...
Im sure SB will enjoy his van, i wish him well, but he joined a thread about Kemerton issues...isnt this the place where folk might discuss these?

Hi Chris to answer your point , yes compared to the Adria the water tanks are very small.Annoying thing is there is room for larger tanks underneath the van and could be sorted easily enough if it becomes a problem. As we rarely camp off grid it has never been an issue as it is easily overcome as stated above with a 5 minute fill/ empty routine every couple of days, hardly an issue .
      Its all how you personally use the van as if going out for the day and using the van for transport I would automatically empty the waste water as I dont see the point of lugging it around . If moving on more than a hundred miles or so I also empty the fresh tank for the same reason. Personal choice but also slightly better fuel economy and road holding/braking not carrying unneccessary weight. Wastemasters etc would work but as you say are large and a problem to carry unless you attach a back box. The bucket and jerry can work perfectly well and are easy to store and take no more than five mins to empty grey  and replenish fresh water.
       We bought the van knowing the size of the water tanks and with full workshop facilities at my disposal my idea was to ditch the tanks and fit larger as a priority. Water leak and build issues put this lower on the priority list but as things pan out , the way we use the van has meant it is not an issue for us. Others may find themselves replacing tanks immediately! 

K. thanks for the objective reply...

Hi Tim and Ruth,
Just to echo Kaspian's comments. We have never had a problem with our water system. The refilling of the water tank is just one of the chores to do when on site, we carry a 10L plastic container and use a submersible pump to top up the tank. How often obviously depends on usage and access to a water supply.
We, unlike some, like the Whale filling system and find it very easy to use. After 4 years of use both home and abroad we have never had a problem with it.

Frank

I second kaspian’s points, the task of filling/emptying water on the Kemerton should be a minor issue. I did find however, a long time ago, filling the whale water system with the blue flat hose was time consuming-annoyance also for anyone waiting to fill-up. Easily speeded up by filling the water tank with the whale submersible pump [supplied] and my collapsible bucket. I do this now: place MH near a filling point tap. Place tap connecter with a SHORT HOSE onto the tap [my hose is about 18 inches long.] Tap on, fill bucket, trying not to create air bubbles [or an air lock in the system might occur]. Place pump in bucket. Connect other end of pump to MH. Turn MH control panel on and regulate the water flow from the outside tap, making sure the pump continues to be submerged in water. My other half carries out the necessary functions inside the MH eg, turning on taps to purge the system of any trapped air.

Mel Battersby wrote:I second kaspian’s points, the task of filling/emptying water on the Kemerton should be a minor issue. I did find however, a long time ago, filling the whale water system with the blue flat hose was time consuming-annoyance also for anyone waiting to fill-up. Easily speeded up by filling the water tank with the whale submersible pump [supplied] and my collapsible bucket.  I do this now: place MH near a filling point tap. Place tap connecter with a SHORT HOSE onto the tap [my hose is about 18 inches long.] Tap on, fill bucket, trying not to create air bubbles [or an air lock in the system might occur]. Place pump in bucket. Connect other end of pump to MH. Turn MH control panel on and regulate the water flow from the outside tap, making sure the pump continues to be submerged in water. My other half carries out the necessary functions inside the MH eg, turning on taps to purge the system of any trapped air.  

Stone me Mel, what a palaver!! I quite agree with you that filling up with water should be a minor issue!  All that faffing would drive me round the bend. Carefully adjusting the fill rate of a bucket so a submersible pump can empty it into the van!! You must have the patience of a saint.  

Would it not be possible and worthwhile to fit a Fiamma "hole in the wall" fill point? Then it's just a case of shoving in the hosepipe or the watering can, and in the latter case the van need not even be moved from the pitch.

I'm not into slagging off A/S but this is one "innovation" that we could have done without. I know some people say they like the Whale system, but they have no choice but to like it if that's all they have.  Fortunately our van has both systems, and the Whale accessories are up in the loft, where they will remain unopened.

Pouring water into a hole has to be the quickest, simplest and most reliable method it's possible to imagine, so why did A/S and a lot of other van builders have to install  a complicated caravan system instead??

Just an opinion, as ever. 

Hi Dave, wish I'd kept quiet and said nowt. Got me in a sweat just writing the procedure out. One day I will treat myself & a 'hole in the wall' it will be.
Mel

Tim and Ruth , also Mel , dont listen to the Luddites be modern ,  why waste time and money sawing big holes in the side of your new van so you can stand supporting a heavy watering can while you fill a hole!
       Stand jerry can on ground , drop pump in , chat to fellow campers , take in the view etc etc and a couple of minutes later job done! I have also never been in such a hurry that it makes any difference emptying a waste tank in 60 seconds or 120! You are on holiday so reeeelaaaaax!

Stupid question but what if the tap is 50m away?
Rich..

RML wrote:Stupid question but what if the tap is 50m away?
Rich..

No problem to we Luddites, we just use the trusty watering can. Much easier than moving the van and faffing around with all those unnecessary fancy gadgets the modern lot like to play with! I reckon they are closet caravanners with nothing better to do than fiddle around making a simple job complicated! 

We each take the can with us to the loo and the shower every couple of days. Two trips each keeps us topped up when on site. Don't even make a special journey to fetch the water. (I have a PhD in idleness!  )

RML wrote:Stupid question but what if the tap is 50m away?
Rich..

20l food grade pvc jerry can . Carried on a fold up  suitcase trolley from post office . Folded small enough to almost fit jacket pocket. Cost around £8. Fits even a watering can so relax , let the new fangled  WHEEL take the strain!    Drop pump into container , admire the view , pass the time of day with fellow campers, 2 mins later job done , no heavy lifting . 
     Gromit, I am an ex closet caravanner, but will  bow to an Idea when it works .  Dont fancy taking my watering can to the bog or showers mind you,  must get some strange looks !

You see so many watering cans on sites now, no-one takes any notice. I use a 10 litre Jerry can with flexible spout attachment. I don't have the whale filler.

I knew it would happen one..... Gromit you are a luddite and at last we disagree on something

I might think of you every time I turn on the shower with the brilliantly simple valve by the head which means I can wash what little hair I have in the sink without soaking the floor, but this time really you have gone too far..... watering can.....please! Paul at least has the decency to use a Jerry can with a spout.

The thing I really like about the whale system is the way Johnny Foreigner appear in groups to observe the machinations of this strange system, much pointing, shoulder shrugging and the obligatory ho-he-hon Froggie banter.

It must be easier to drop the pump in to your watering can (please! ) instead of lifting the thing up and pouring water through a hole in the wall.

Collapsible container takes no storage space, thrust it in Lady G's hand, point her towards the tap, recline on sofa and pour beer. Job done!

I love the whale system and hardly ever stick the hose in the hole, too much hard work watching her roll the thing up again and putting it back in its container!

Love
'Hog

Tim and Ruth ...well done lovely van and lots of happy travels (sans watering can)

groundhog wrote:It must be easier to drop the pump in to your watering can (please! ) instead of lifting the thing up and pouring water through a hole in the wall.

Easier still with an Aquaroll, quick fill at the tap than roll your 40 litres to your Whale filler and take in the view (about 4 minutes) no lifting or splashing. Appreciate could be storage problem with smaller van.

Paramedic wrote:

groundhog wrote:It must be easier to drop the pump in to your watering can (please! ) instead of lifting the thing up and pouring water through a hole in the wall.

Easier still with an Aquaroll, quick fill at the tap than roll your 40 litres to your Whale filler and take in the view (about 4 minutes) no lifting or splashing. Appreciate could be storage problem with smaller van.

Yep!
Got it in one.