Symphony water pump on, water not coming out?

by PennyB Mon Apr 01, 2013 7:59 pm

Preparing our new van for going away for the first time, my OH drained down the water system as described in the manual including the water heater. The heater is a Propex Malaga 4E. He put back half a tank of water and put the water pump on, which he can hear working, but even after half an hour no water is coming out of the taps. have turned the pump off now, but are supposed to be going away tomorrow!
Please can anyone help us sort out what to do?
Many thanks,
Penny

by -mojo- Mon Apr 01, 2013 9:36 pm

Can you hear whether the pump has self-primed or not? Generally the sound will change from a rapid chattering to a slower thudding sound.

Do you have the taps open to allow the system to expell air?

In my experience those Shurflo pumps tend to get less able to lift water and prime themselves as they get older. My solution was to fit an in-line pump at the tank outlet, only used for priming, but others seem to get by just sucking air from one or other of the sink taps - at the risk of getting an unexpected mouthfull of water...

by ubuntu1 Mon Apr 01, 2013 9:37 pm

Not sure what the temperatures are like near you but I have had a number of vans that have been frozen up. Try running the heating in your van for four or five hours and then try again.

by PennyB Mon Apr 01, 2013 9:57 pm

Thanks mojo and ubuntu. We did have the taps open but I'm not sure if it self-primed - it sounds like that might be the problem. We'll have a go at fixing it in the morning. Thanks for your suggestions, much appreciated, Penny.

by Dutto Mon Apr 01, 2013 11:03 pm

Hi there,

Start with the hot taps closed and one cold tap open.

Attach a hose to the spigot of the open tap. Start the pump and start sucking on the hose.

When you start choking on the water stop sucking on the hose and let the water run for a few seconds.

(If water doesn't arrive after a few minutes then either there is insufficient water in the tank, there is a massive leak somewhere between the tank and the pump, the pump is totally useless or there is a massive leak between the pump and the tap. First thing to do is to stop the pump and check if your feet are wet!)

When flow is established through the first cold tap open up the other cold taps one at a time until you get air-free flow from all of them.

Close all the cold taps and open up one hot tap.

Let the pump run until air-free flow comes out of the hot tap. (This may take a few minutes because the water heater has to be filled.)

Open up the other hot taps until you get air-free flow from all of them.

Close the last hot tap and listen for the pump to stop. (There will be a short delay. This is because there is usually an accumulator in the hot water system that allows the water to expand when it is heated.)

The system is now full. Test everything is working OK by turning taps on and off a few times and then you can start the Hot Water Heater if you wish.

(If the pump doesn't stop after a couple of minutes then either the "On/Off" pressure switch isn't working properly or there is a leak downstream of the pump. Switch the pump off and check if your feet are wet! If not check out the pressure switch.)

Hope this helps. allthumbz

Best regards,
drinksallround

by PennyB Tue Apr 02, 2013 11:21 pm

Thanks for all the advice. My OH tried sucking the air out via the taps which didn't work. He then tried plugging into the mains electricity and turned the water pump back on which sounded healthier and after a couple of minutes the water started to flow. It seems the leisure battery was not fully charged, and so the pump was not working properly. It has been a bit of a palaver, but we know now for next time! Thanks again forum people, PennyB.

by Flying High Wed Apr 03, 2013 1:26 am

Thanks Dutto for the info, I will be filling the tank shortly, if we get any warm weather. cold

I have already camped over Easter without running water and it is a pain.

Printed off you method and will try soon. read

Best regards, Mike courtesy

by Flying High Wed Apr 10, 2013 9:05 am

Thanks Dutto for the information, I did it yesterday and you instructions went just fine I now have hot and cold running water.
Just a rider to anyone doing this, I looked at the kitchen sink tap and thought, "how do I get a pipe over that to suck up the water" then I realised that the bathroom tap was a lot easier to fit a small pipe over so I used that. One big suck and out came the water which I spat out into the sink and away the system went. All the other taps spluttered a bit and the flowed water. Fired up the Carver with the gas on and low and behold, warm water what a result.

Winnie now has hot and cold running water. hairdryer

Just a point, it there a gauge on the tank to show how much water is in it, I pressed the "water" button on the control panel and nothing happened?

Best regards, Mike courtesy

by chrisvesey Wed Apr 10, 2013 9:21 am

Hi,
On my van from full the guage drops rapidly to empty but there is stil about a quarter of a tank at least, also the easiest place to suck up the water is the shower hose after you take the spray head of you can even sit down,
Chris

by mikethebike Fri Apr 12, 2013 6:05 pm

Flying High wrote:Thanks Dutto for the information, I did it yesterday and you instructions went just fine I now have hot and cold running water.
Just a rider to anyone doing this, I looked at the kitchen sink tap and thought, "how do I get a pipe over that to suck up the water" then I realised that the bathroom tap was a lot easier to fit a small pipe over so I used that. One big suck and out came the water which I spat out into the sink and away the system went. All the other taps spluttered a bit and the flowed water. Fired up the Carver with the gas on and low and behold, warm water what a result.

Winnie now has hot and cold running water.

Just a point, there is a gauge on the tank panel to show how much water is in the tank. I pressed the "water" button on the control panel and nothing happened?

Best regards, Mike

Hi ,There is an adjuster to set the water level. Best to fill to full and then set it to full it is very sensitive, its next to the gauge.
Just done my fill and bleed . Not important to suck or the exact sequence of tap open and closing needed.
Dont forget the bleed outside on the heater.its the small screw at the top.
As you found,use the mains electricity.
I easily heard the pump going on and stopping when pressure had raised.
Afew splashes in the sink,but feet are dry. smile!

regards

mike hugegrins

by Flying High Fri Apr 12, 2013 11:18 pm

[quote
Hi ,There is an adjuster to set the water level. Best to fill to full and then set it to full it is very sensitive, its next to the gauge.
Just done my fill and bleed . Not important to suck or the exact sequence of tap open and closing needed.
Dont forget the bleed outside on the heater.its the small screw at the top.
As you found,use the mains electricity.
I easily heard the pump going on and stopping when pressure had raised.
Afew splashes in the sink,but feet are dry. smile!

regards

mike hugegrins

[/quote]

Thanks Mike,

Forgot about the heater bleed screw on top, will check tomorrow.

Thanks for the info re the gauge, I put some more water in and it shows a quarter full so seems to be working now.

Regards, Mike courtesy

by PennyB Sat Apr 13, 2013 12:14 am

Good to know about the water level adjuster too. Thanks.
PennyB

by Paulmold Sat Apr 13, 2013 2:17 pm

I thought the pressure relief valve was only used to speed up the emptying of the heater. You learn something new every day.

by Andrewjohn Sat Apr 13, 2013 4:46 pm

I had a problem yesterday filling our Symbol.
Filled tank then opened kitchen taps, got water but not great flow. Opened up shower taps and got very good flow, same with bathroom sink.
Went back to kitchen tap and ended up with no flow at all, checked tap inserts, no problem, and there was loads of pressure there as I got soaked. (Forgot to open the pressure valve).
Reset and eventually got water out of the kitchen tap, but still not great pressure.
Wife's gone away in it tonight, so will have to see how it is tomorrow.

by AndrewKWhite Tue Sep 08, 2015 9:30 pm

Dutto wrote:Hi there,

Start with the hot taps closed and one cold tap open.

Attach a hose to the spigot of the open tap. Start the pump and start sucking on the hose.

When you start choking on the water stop sucking on the hose and let the water run for a few seconds.

(If water doesn't arrive after a few minutes then either there is insufficient water in the tank, there is a massive leak somewhere between the tank and the pump, the pump is totally useless or there is a massive leak between the pump and the tap. First thing to do is to stop the pump and check if your feet are wet!)

When flow is established through the first cold tap open up the other cold taps one at a time until you get air-free flow from all of them.

Close all the cold taps and open up one hot tap.

Let the pump run until air-free flow comes out of the hot tap. (This may take a few minutes because the water heater has to be filled.)

Open up the other hot taps until you get air-free flow from all of them.

Close the last hot tap and listen for the pump to stop. (There will be a short delay. This is because there is usually an accumulator in the hot water system that allows the water to expand when it is heated.)

The system is now full. Test everything is working OK by turning taps on and off a few times and then you can start the Hot Water Heater if you wish.

(If the pump doesn't stop after a couple of minutes then either the "On/Off" pressure switch isn't working properly or there is a leak downstream of the pump. Switch the pump off and check if your feet are wet! If not check out the pressure switch.)

Hope this helps.

Best regards,

by Boston Blue Thu Oct 08, 2015 10:15 pm

Help ! I have a similar problem to above . With the pump on , water is "pumping out of an overflow or breather pipe outside. (small dia pipe).
I have only filled tank to 1/4 full. This is first time i have drained it down.
i have tried opening taps in case of air locks. Water comes through taps but at low rate because majority being pumped all over drive scratch head

.

Hope one of you experienced and clever peoples can help as going away tomorrow.

by moggyminor1966 Thu Oct 08, 2015 10:25 pm

Boston Blue wrote:Help ! I have a similar problem to above . With the pump on , water is "pumping out of an overflow or breather pipe outside. (small dia pipe).
I have only filled tank to 1/4 full. This is first time i have drained it down.
i have tried opening taps in case of air locks. Water comes through taps but at low rate because majority being pumped all over drive .

Hope one of you experienced and clever peoples can help as going away tomorrow.

Just a thought have you closed the hot water tank drain valve?

by Boston Blue Thu Oct 08, 2015 10:31 pm

Hi Moggy, I haven't opened it ......... But tell me more ?

by moggyminor1966 Thu Oct 08, 2015 10:44 pm

Hi Boston blue I assumed that you had previously drained your van down and normally I leave the hot tank drain valve open. If on refilling if you forget to close it then the water will dribble out underneath.
As this does not appear to be the problem are you able to identify exactly where the pipe comes from that the water is coming out?
Perhaps an owner with a Symphony may be able to help you further.
Do hope you get it sorted so you can get away.

by Boston Blue Thu Oct 08, 2015 10:54 pm

Thanks , Just been out n had a look with a torch . The small pipe that water is pumping out from; disappears through the floor and inside the van somewhere.
Will investigate some more tomorrow.

Worse case we use bottle and containered water for washing drinking etc

by bikeralw Fri Oct 09, 2015 9:25 am

If you have the Truma heater, the pipe you refer to is item 20 on the sketch. This is connected to a one way valve, item 12, that lets air into the heater to allow the water to drain when you open the dump valve, item 14. It only operates if you don't open a hot tap when draining.
The problem that can occur is because the end of the pipe is in an exposed position, dirt can get sucked up the small pipe and cause the valve to stick open. This happened to me, but my valve only had a slow drip. The solution is a new valve and pipe, it only costs £10 or so.
To stop it happening again, always remember to open the hot taps when you drain down.
Al
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by Boston Blue Fri Oct 09, 2015 10:08 am

Wow Excellent advise Al. Do you think if i drain down this morning , this time with the valve open ,it may unstick the valve enough to use it this weekend ?

Chris

by Boston Blue Fri Oct 09, 2015 10:41 am

Ok , Hot water valve and pipe ordered smile!

from "caravanparts.uk. Nice one Al . Thank you again .

chris

by bikeralw Fri Oct 09, 2015 10:57 am

I guess you could always attach a bit of pipe to the end of the leaking pipe and try sucking and blowing, it may free it. Whatever you do don't try blocking it off, or the next time you switch on the pump the small pipe may blow off the valve by the heater, then you'd have a flood inside the van!
Al.

Symphony water pump on, water not coming out?

Symphony water pump on, water not coming out?

Re: Symphony water pump on, water not coming out?

pump

Thanks

Re: Symphony water pump on, water not coming out?

Thanks water working now!

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Re: Symphony water pump on, water not coming out?

Re: Symphony water pump on, water not coming out?

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Re: Symphony water pump on, water not coming out?

Re: Symphony water pump on, water not coming out?

Re: Symphony water pump on, water not coming out?

Re: Symphony water pump on, water not coming out?

Brilliant! With vacuum hose immediate result.

Re: Symphony water pump on, water not coming out?

Re: Symphony water pump on, water not coming out?

Re: Symphony water pump on, water not coming out?

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Re: Symphony water pump on, water not coming out?

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Re: Symphony water pump on, water not coming out?