Propane 3.9 sizes.

Has anyone else got the tiny Talbot Harmony gas locker under the wardrobe and is finding that the newer Flogas and other make tanks with higher collar don't fit?

I am fed up with sourcing the old smaller/stubbier ones. Finally went to the Flogas Staveley depot. They say :- Don't do locker resizing yet, as although they are phasing out that type of tank it will be around for a while. He thinks by ringing up before I visit to get them to save one, I may get 18mths to 2 years supply before I need to change the locker size. So I thought I'd pass the info on.

Any other advice and/or cute ideas very welcome.

I did have one Flogas and one Calor propane but swapped the Flogas out for a Calor when it ran out. I never noticed any difference between the two bottles except that one had "Flogas" and the other "Calor" painted on the side.
Please tell me more about these new bottles, any chance of a comparison photo?

Frank

Vardy wrote:Has anyone else got the tiny Talbot Harmony gas locker under the wardrobe and is finding that the newer Flogas and other make tanks with higher collar don't fit?

I am fed up with sourcing the old smaller/stubbier ones.

I agree.....plus the costs of a refill are quite staggering.

I have two 3kg Polish bottles and a refill in Poland costs just four pounds!! Easily available at most Garages but if they don't have one you just go along to the nearest centre and they fill your bottle while you wait. All we seem to do here in UK is screw folk for every penny cent possible.

This is one of my bottles being filled.
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boxerman wrote:
Please tell me more about these new bottles, any chance of a comparison photo?

The small Flogas and Calor bottles were always the same size so you wouldn’t see any difference.
I got caught out last year when I exchanged a Flogas bottle and got the larger one. It didn’t fit. The problem is that they have the same sized collar as the larger bottles and just don’t fit.
Changing the size of the cupboard looks a pig (no insult to pigs intended) to cut a long story short I ended up replacing it with a Calor bottle. If all smaller bottles are to be phased out it’s bad news. I still have the larger bottle “in stock” because I can’t use it!

(I can take a photo at the weekend if nobody else comes up with one first)

Brod

I can't do a photo but the Red propane (good in winter as It freezes at lower temp) 3.9 has always been served up in a rounded stubby bottle with a wide 'rolled ring' type collar. There is only about an inch or so in it, which is to do with the collar height. The new one is not so wide around and is slightly taller.

It's hard to identify unless the two are side by side and even the gas employee reserved the wrong one last visit. My son picked it up and had to travel miles to take it back.

The change is so subtle I spent lots of frustrating hours squirming around upside down in the "bilges" until I spotted the difference.

Plus the comment about altering the locker is very valid - it's a sound build and a shame to interfere with it, or the wardrobe. My best idea involved cutting around inside the bottom of the wardrobe and raising/hinging it with a catch to hold the 'lid' when lifted. Thus gas bottle could be dropped in easily.

Got to shift all your knickers and vests first though

Vardy wrote:My best idea involved cutting around inside the bottom of the wardrobe and raising/hinging it with a catch to hold the 'lid' when lifted. Thus gas bottle could be dropped in easily.

I had to replace the seatbelt for the rear passenger seat a couple of MOTs ago and this meant stripping out the bottom and back of the wardrobe. I had much the same thoughts as you about turning the wardrobe bottom into a lid for the convenience of being able to "drop" a bottle in. I didn't do it though as it isn't too much of a struggle to get the bottles in and out.

Got to shift all your knickers and vests first though

We keep our knickers & vests in the cupboard above the wardrobe

Frank

Vardy

Must admit i'm not certain precisely what your problem is. I exchanged a Propane earlier this year and got the same size bottle back.

I also bought an empty bottle off eBay as another spare for two quid......and was pleasantly surprised when I went to pick it up to find it was almost a full bottle! The guy just wanted rid of it and there are bargains to be found like this on ebay if you search around.

Bulletguy wrote:Vardy
Must admit i'm not certain precisely what your problem is.

The problem is that there are new propane bottles in circulation that are bigger than the old ones and don’t fit in the locker. Like you I solved the problem by replacing my Flogas bottles with second hand Calor versions.
Thing is, If the smaller bottles disappear completely we will not be able to get suitable replacements.

Brod.

Vardy wrote:My best idea involved cutting around inside the bottom of the wardrobe and raising/hinging it with a catch to hold the 'lid' when lifted. Thus gas bottle could be dropped in easily.

Sounds a good idea. I didn’t think of that when I was looking at the problem. It still needs a bit of thinking about because you have to make sure that the gas locker has a gas tight seal between it and the living area. I suppose the downside is that you would need to partially empty the wardrobe when changing a bottle.
My initial thoughts were that the wardrobe floor needed rising by ½ an inch or so (an inch would be better). That would men shortening the upper door and making the lower door bigger. I’m confident that I could make a replacement door but my woodworking skills are nowhere near good enough to make a door that matches the high standard of the original.
One comfort is that the problem will affect large numbers of people so hopefully someone will come up with the solution. What do the AS staff monitoring this forum think? Maybe there’s a commercial case for a conversion kit!

As for the other problem I’m a “He Man” so I don’t need vests even in winter.

Brod

brodco wrote:That would men shortening the upper door and making the lower door bigger.

Not really, you could raise the floor of the wardrobe and not touch the doors, it would just mean that you would have a step at the bottom of the wardrobe when you opened the door.

Frank

brodco wrote:

Bulletguy wrote:Vardy
Must admit i'm not certain precisely what your problem is.

The problem is that there are new propane bottles in circulation that are bigger than the old ones and don’t fit in the locker. Like you I solved the problem by replacing my Flogas bottles with second hand Calor versions.
Thing is, If the smaller bottles disappear completely we will not be able to get suitable replacements.

Have you contacted your local Calor Centre about this?

Reason I ask is at one time these small bottles could be found chucked in skips or littering the countryside, as there was no deposit on them so were worthless. Because of this Calor began slapping a hefty deposit on a bottle thereby ensuring it's return. It was a guy at my local Calor place who told me this because they were fed up with complaints about empty bottles being dumped. Of course now every supplier charges a deposit.

boxerman wrote:
Not really, you could raise the floor of the wardrobe and not touch the doors, it would just mean that you would have a step at the bottom of the wardrobe when you opened the door.

Thanks Frank that’s a much better idea.

Bulletguy wrote:
Have you contacted your local Calor Centre about this?

I must admit I haven’t but then the thread was only started yesterday. I changed to Calor a year or so ago. At the time I had a chat with the dealer about the “larger” bottle problem and he had never seen or heard of a larger Calor bottle. Hopefully anyone with the Flogas problem could just change to Calor so no need to panic yet.

It’s good to have a plan just in case Calor go the same way though. I think I'll email the Calor service people anyway - Just to make sure!

Brod.

Yes, my best idea was to have a 'step' in the wardrobe of about an inch. So glad someone else thinks it's viable. Also, I mentioned the gas seal issue to Flogas and didn't get any answers. Thought I might need to ensure it was gas tight!

When I was chatting to Flogas, they told me they have a big fleet customer with service vans who use this size and are scratching their heads currently as the cost of converting hundreds of gas lockers is prohibitive.

I swap my bottle at Flogas, as other suppliers are quite strict here about echanging a bottle that isn't 'theirs' - Plus, it's not always possible to get it filled as a one off on demand. Their fill plant is not on constantly - and it's a joke to ask for it to be turned on for 1 mincy little bottle.

So I ring in advance and they are dead good. I have 2 bottles but might get a third one (getting empties is not a problem - it's the swapping) which would give me one in the van, one spare and one to leave in the depot to fill. So I can then always rotate my own bottles.

What d'ya think? - is it a plan?

Vardy wrote:
I swap my bottle at Flogas, as other suppliers are quite strict here about echanging a bottle that isn't 'theirs' - Plus, it's not always possible to get it filled as a one off on demand. Their fill plant is not on constantly - and it's a joke to ask for it to be turned on for 1 mincy little bottle.

I’m a bit confused. Don’t you just exchange them for a full one at a dealer? I've never heard of anyone getting there own bottle filled.
Anyway I got a reply from Calor. It seems they don’t plan to change the size of their bottles so why not get a couple of second hand Calor empties – problem solved. You wouldn't have any trouble getting them exchanged Calor dealers are all over the UK. That said I never had any trouble getting Flogas when I was using it!

Here’s a copy of the message:

Hello,

Thanks for your recent email enquiry.

In regards to your query, in the near future there are no plans in order to alter the size of our 3.9kg Propane Cylinder.

Kind regards,

Sam Baker
Telemarketing
Calor Gas Ltd.
Tel: 0800 626626
Email: [You must be registered and logged in to see this link.]

Brod

brodco wrote: Hopefully anyone with the Flogas problem could just change to Calor so no need to panic yet.

I have a large Flogas bottle I use in a mobile heater. Only reason I ended up with it is the place I use to exchange used to be a Calor dealer but went over to Flogas. Calor won't exchange Flogas bottles for Calor.....and the price of Flogas is more than Calor. The easiest way to get Calor is to buy an empty bottle of the shape/size you want off ebay and then take it along to any Calor stockist.

boxerman wrote:
Please tell me more about these new bottles, any chance of a comparison photo?

Here is a picture of the two bottles for anyone that hasn't come across the problem yet. I haven't got an old "Flogas" bottle but they were the same size as the Calor version.



Brod.

I can that is a major problem if the 3.9 is the only size you can fit. Luckily in the later Boxer based van conversions like my Symphony you can fit one 6kg and one 3.9 or two 3.9's. Flogas are going to lose out on this market.

hello all. This may not help in this particular evnt but I get my gas from Go Outdoors as they offer a brilliany discount. I sourced empty bottles from ebay and always change them so I,ve got full ones at home. I use propane in my Duetto as i have the same problem with the height of the locker. And dont forget, with this design of effectivly having the gas locker inside the van it would be very unlikely if it would get so cold the propane would "freeze". I use one of these little bottles on my BBQ and it still works in our winters.
Regards, David.

d.l.hunter wrote:hello all. This may not help in this particular evnt but I get my gas from Go Outdoors as they offer a brilliany discount.

Sorry David but I don't think you can call £1.53 a "brilliant discount",(prices taken from Go Outdoors and Calor websites) especially as you have to spend £5 per year for a card to obtain this discount.

Frank

Hello Frank. In my book any discount these days is brilliant, but last time i went to go out doors a few weeks back a 4.5 kg butane was £14 quid and at my calour outlet its £23 quid. Bingo---no brainer. As for the £5 card, i buy other things through the year, especially when they have thier special offers on. Worth ever penny.
Regards, David

Me again. Frank, the prices you compared were Go Outdoors prices not calor. I see they have an extra discount on the 4.5kg bottle. The £15.99 price is their already discounted price---if that makes sense. At the £14.39 price it makes it over 8 quid cheaper than calor. Like I say---no brainer.

Hi David
I know which sites I compared. The prices I compared were from the Calor Gas site:
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And the Go Outdoors site:
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If you've been charged £23 for a 4.5 butane Calor then I'm afraid you've been ripped off mate. I pay around £15 - £16 for an exchange 3.9k propane refill no matter where I go, from Shetland to South Wales, without any discounts as that is the "standard" Calor price.
You're not getting confused with Camping Gaz 907s are you? I think they are 3.7k (?) butane and cost around £23 - £24.

Frank

My Symbol is the same, it came with a 7kg and a small blue bottle. I need a pigtail to use the small bottle as it is a screw in and the one on the 7KG is push on. I could swap to red as they are better when it gets colder and only needs one pigtail. But as you all say the locker is small and awkward to use, so for convenience I am thinking of having gaslow or gasit fitted , with a filler on the outside.

Gary

boxerman wrote:Hi David
I know which sites I compared. The prices I compared were from the Calor Gas site:
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And the Go Outdoors site:
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If you've been charged £23 for a 4.5 butane Calor then I'm afraid you've been ripped off mate. I pay around £15 - £16 for an exchange 3.9k propane refill no matter where I go, from Shetland to South Wales, without any discounts as that is the "standard" Calor price.
You're not getting confused with Camping Gaz 907s are you? I think they are 3.7k (?) butane and cost around £23 - £24.

Frank

I know which sites you compared frank. But alalong I have said I use a 4.5 butane bottle. The calor web site says £15.99---but---you will pay delivery charges which will bring the price right up. i have done these exersises before to get the best deal, so I know I am saving about eight quid.
I also have more gas than the propane version for the same money.

d.l.hunter wrote:

I know which sites you compared frank. But alalong I have said I use a 4.5 butane bottle. The calor web site says £15.99---but---you will pay delivery charges which will bring the price right up. i have done these exersises before to get the best deal, so I know I am saving about eight quid.
I also have more gas than the propane version for the same money.

Compare like with like David (with a capital "D" you'll note). You can't compare the price of one item delivered against another where you collect it yourself.
I give up

Frank