Solar Panels

I want a solar panel, I would like a 200wt ,but told van roof not big enough. Would a 100wt be worth it for fringe and tv, and roughly the cost.would like to do wild camping at the most for 3 to 4 days for the scenery.

You could also consider a portable 100w/120w suitcase type solar panel.  Thats what I use and I find it perfectly capable, although I dont carry a tv or run the fridge with it.

We've had 100w panels on 3 mh's now and all were connected to a dual battery solar regulator so charged both the starter battery and the leisure one.
This has proved to be more than adequate for our needs.
You most certainly won't be able to run a fridge though, we have led lighting, CH fan if cold, TV, and charge tablets phones etc, though usually we charge them when on the move.

Yes 100W should be fine for a few days.

Even with the standard 80W that came with the Symbol it could manage 2-3 days no problem during the summer months.

I doubled up to 160W total which will provide me with enough now for what I need, but I've previously fitted 100W to other vans and as above, for 3 season camping it's fine (fridge on gas).

Have you looked into fitting 2 panels though?  The duetto roof should be able to take 2 from memory which can be combined to around 140W.

Hi Greyhound, out of interest was there room for another 80w panel or was it 2 x 40w panels?

woodlice wrote:Hi Greyhound, out of interest was there room for another 80w panel or was it 2 x 40w panels?

On my Symbol?  I just added a second 80W at the back and ran it in parallel with the one fitted by AS - they both ran at the same voltage so going in parallel made sense and also kept the voltage under the max stated for my controller.

In addition to you fitting a solar panel to your van, have you already considered which solar controller to buy?
Currently the best are MTTP controllers, next best is PWM, down the line are 2 stage controllers, cheap and beloved by Sargent.
Several PWM controllers have Dual outputs, for the leisure and vehicle battery. I had a Morningstar Dual PWM in our previous van which worked well, solar charging distributed 50%, or 95%/5%, your choice. MTTP controllers are more efficient but few have a dual battery charging function. I chose a Votronic MTT because it has a 1 amp trickle charge for the vehicle battery, otherwise most goes into the leisure battery.

I'm not able to help you with what solar panel to buy because we had a Duetto based on a later model MWB Transit. I fitted a 69 watt Sunware panel which for this roof was probably the maximum. (after many hours of searching)

PS: A whole new topic is around the additional fitting of a temperature sensor if you've got solar panel(s) charging your leisure battery. This hasn't as far as I know been covered anywhere on ASOF. I've just bought one for my Votronic solar controller. I did fit one with my Morningstar PWM Duo Duetto install, but the performance of my new Votronic MTTP controller looks to be altered by the presence of there being a temperature sensor being physically in contact with the leisure battery.

Carolwalkersherriff wrote: Would a 100wt be worth it for fringe and tv, and roughly the cost.would like to do wild camping at the most for 3 to 4 days for the scenery.

Obviously the answer is very dependent on your usage. I am wondering if a leisure battery alone will suffice if all you want is 3 days before the battery is flat.
How long do you manage at present without any solar panel?

AutoSleepy_Don wrote:

Carolwalkersherriff wrote: Would a 100wt be worth it for fringe and tv, and roughly the cost.would like to do wild camping at the most for 3 to 4 days for the scenery.

Obviously the answer is very dependent on your usage. I am wondering if a leisure battery alone will suffice if all you want is 3 days before the battery is flat.
How long do you manage at present without any solar panel?

In my self build VW T5 I had a 110ah leisure battery which I could squeeze 2 days out of off grid camping.
This was watching plenty of TV in the evening, charging phones and the main drain, a Waeco CR50 compressor fridge. With a 3 way on gas I’m sure 4 days would have been easily achievable.

I think we need to establish the type of fridge in the van and if it is the standard 3 way as mentioned.

Carolwalkersherriff wrote:I want a solar panel, I would like a 200wt ,but told van roof not big enough. Would a 100wt be worth it for fringe and tv, and roughly the cost.would like to do wild camping at the most for 3 to 4 days for the scenery.

I think that you may struggle to get a 100 watt panel on the roof of a 1996 Duetto (on a MK4 Transit). We used to have a 1999 version (on a MK5) and due to the limited roof space the only solution was to fit multiple panels and even then the maximum was circa 80 watts.

If you have the original 3-way fridge, then as has been said, you cannot run this on battery power, it must be either gas or mains electricity. 

We managed 3 days (in late spring to early autumn) in our Duetto without a solar panel, but this of course depends on how much power per day you actually use. It is difficult to advise without more detailed data, but my best advice would be to look at fitting a bigger leisure battery as this would be a cheaper option to several small panels.

Thanks for all your advice.

If you take a look at PeterHum's setup apparently he managed 130W (an 80W and a 50W) on his Mk 5 Duetto.

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Not sure how it differs from a Mk4 on the roof, but I'm sure you could do similar.

Failing that, as others have mentioned, there's always a fold out panel you could use.  A bit of a faff but an option.

Just returned from 13 weeks off-grid (almost) in France. No sites open but many Aires are and I was fortunate to get back to Tonneins Municipal Aire  on the River Garonne where I stayed for 5 weeks when Spain closed the boarder. just as I arrived! Thank you Tonneins.

The Aire, located directly by the river, has free water/waste and 2 Euro 5 hour electric hook-up. One could only dream of having such facilities in UK.

During the five weeks I needed to use the EHU just three times for water heater convenience for clothes washing.

I carried a 2nd leisure battery wired in parallel. A cheap 150 watt cigar lighter inverter  to charge the laptop.

My interior lights have all been converted to LCD. You can fit five strips in each of the Labcraft lights (too bright I think).

I use tablet or phone to watch stored films/TV shows/Music and the lap-top for big-screen stuff.

Never ran out of power in 13 weeks just by having occasional engine running sessions or - when escaped from lock-down - daily driving  (very slowly) towards the port (only possible when I had booking to hand). 

When I was close to Roscoff Brittany Ferries cancelled the sailings for a further month necessitating an extra 500 miles via Dieppe/Newhaven on a virtually empty ferry - well done DFDS for service.


Slightly off-topic:
France was running an excellent 'Attestation' system during the height of the lock-down using an app to easily fill out your name location etc and it proves how long you have been out due to the one hour exercise/shopping restriction. Not having it to show £125 fine.

Thanks all

Those with van conversions, has anyone themselves fitted a second solar panel on their van's roof and routed the cable through the existing factory fitted white plastic "Waterproof Double Gland" ? As below-

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If you have, how did things go?

That gland is for a single cable, usually the solar panel +ve, the -ve being connected to vehicle skin, as is the -ve battery terminal of the starter, for example.
A dual gland version could do the same, but most are for one core each of the 2 from the solar panel when the -ve is taken inside the vehicle to connect to the solar controller. Not the end of the world to fit a second dual core gland?

IanH wrote:That gland is for a single cable, usually the solar panel +ve, the -ve being connected to vehicle skin, as is the -ve battery terminal of the starter, for example.
A dual gland version could do the same, but most are for one core each of the 2 from the solar panel when the -ve is taken inside the vehicle to connect to the solar controller. Not the end of the world to fit a second dual core gland?

If I were fitting a second solar panel, on the roof I'd be looking to unscrew the existing white plastic dual gland moulding that currently has only one gland and fit a second waterproof cable gland by its side.

Regarding the solar cable connections, my understanding is that the -ve is not connected to the vehicle, my Votronic controller's instructions warns against this, ".... or to the vehicle (-) chassis might falsify the internal current metering of the unit and is not admissible".

Something I'm learning, it seems that on modern motorhomes the negative side of many appliances are unlikely to be grounded at the appliance. In cars that I've owned in the distant past and our first motor caravan too, there was extensive use of the chassis in the negative return path. But how do you provide a ground return in a wooden or fibreglass boat, or a motorhome built of plastic/fibreglass it doesn't have much exposed metal. I'd say that today the wiring looms include the return path for the negatives to go back to the central fuses box area. This must also speeds up the manufacturing process, no need to provide multiple negative groundings to the chassis, it's all in the wiring loom.

Recently I fitted an extra 12V cigarette lighter socket in our van the old way, running a +ve cable to a fuse then on to the leisure battery. For the grounding I did what I always have done, screwed into the metalwork and fixed a terminal which I crimped (and also soldered for safe measure).

OK it might not be universal but in our Kemerton XL the wiring loom has many extra wires not connected to anything. Sargent also supply their EC700 system to other makes of motorvans, Swift for one, you can see the other manufacturers on our LCD panel. Select a different manufacturer and habitation lights start coming on in our van, weird.

This morning wondering if I could feed the water pump with +ve 12 volts, I disconnected the spade connector and provided a link to the the leisure battery, nothing. I strongly suspect that the pump does through a double pole relay at the PSU which also interrupt the -ve return too.

Does your van have a Sargent system?

That's good to know. I've just been back to the van to check, I can power up the water pump by just providing a +ve feed. Previously I'd used my multimeter before which must have been on the wrong setting.

What I did experience just now was water coming out of the Truma drain onto the ground, the blue button had come out. We've not used the van for some while and in this time there must have been some cold weather.