1996 Duetto

Hi, i'm new to the forum. I'm looking at autosleepers for a trip round Europe, and to effectively be my home for the forseable future.
I've heard of some issues with rust with the old transits, but this one has no advisories and seems to have had a lot of work done recently, so I'm thinking of going to have a look in the next days.
I was originaly looking at T4 conversions, but i've recently been thinking I'd like something bigger. My only slight reservation is, i've only jsut passed my driving test. I'm 27 so I've managed to get a couple of pretty reasonable insurnace quotes. 7-800 will probably seem a lot to older members, but a firend of mine just got a similar quote for a ford Ka.... Since I'v never driving something so big, I'm wondering what the learning curve will be like. How different will the experience be of driving a duetto, to driving something based on a T4?
this is what I've been looking at.
Apparently I'm not allowed to post links, it's a 1996 for 9995 with no advisories and 78K on the clock anyway, Seems great, and I love the look of the older auto sleepers against newer vans as well.

Fire in a few more posts and after five (I think) you will be able to post links.

Admin has had to do this to try and stop the spambots from flooding the forum with rubbish. They caused quite a severe problem recently - hence the ban until members have proved themselves to be genuine. 

A Duetto probably isn't a bad choice - parts availability may not quite be on a par with a T4, but there's probably not much in it, and the parts will probably be cheaper!

Before you go and look, please make sure that you know the difference between cosmetic rust on a Transit and structural rust. Some of this can be quite hard to spot (e.g. hidden under the plastic scuttle cover, or up inside the front suspension turrets). Replacing the almost obligatory rusty outer wings is cheap, but some of the other bits are not.

Around that time there were some changes that made the Transit much nicer to drive - for example power steering and the TDi engine - so it would be worth researching those features before you start looking seriously. IMO if it has both of the above it's a very pleasant driving experience, for a van. The only thing that might take a bit of getting used to is the length - a Duetto is on the LWB (or was it MWB?) base which is fairly long. The model I had was a Flair, and that's a SWB which is really hardly any bigger than an estate car or utility vehicle.

One further comment: the advantage of a T4 with rock&roll bed layout is that you can have a big bed ready to sleep on in seconds, while on most other layouts it tends to be a bit more of a time-consuming business...

When I first bought a camper van, a VW T25, I was concerned about its size. That was until I realised it was smaller than the Granada I was during at the time. After that I changed to a mk 6 Transit (while my daily driver was a Smart) so similar to your T4 to mk 5 Transit. I'm still not comfortable in the larger vehicles but it is nothing to be concerned about. You pretty quickly adjust to the limits of whatever you are driving. Good luck with your purchase.

Gromit wrote:Fire in a few more posts and after five (I think) you will be able to post links.

Admin has had to do this to try and stop the spambots from flooding the forum with rubbish. They caused quite a severe problem recently - hence the ban until members have proved themselves to be genuine. 

Gromit...the guy seems legit as he's posted the same question on another forum and this is the van he's looking at (hope i'm not upsetting any mods?!    if so feel free to remove link). He's just seeking advice/tips from fellow Duetto owners. My advice was to get down asap to have a look at it as it won't be around for long at that price and seems a pretty tidy van.

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I see that you (Troubadour) are in Surrey. I will warn you to be careful with a pre 2002 diesel if there is any chance that you venture inside the M25. The London LEZ has a very high daily charge. It doesn't cover the whole of the M25 but does cover enough that a wrong turning can be expensive. Obviously if you are in Guildford the risk of hitting the LEZ is a lot lower than for me in Purley.

dbroada wrote:I see that you (Troubadour) are in Surrey. I will warn you to be careful with a pre 2002 diesel if there is any chance that you venture inside the M25. The London LEZ has a very high daily charge. It doesn't cover the whole of the M25 but does cover enough that a wrong turning can be expensive. Obviously if you are in Guildford the risk of hitting the LEZ is a lot lower than for me in Purley.

That's a right pain in the proverbial for me too as my son and his family live just inside the LEZ meaning i can no longer take my van to their house. It was during batty BoJo's term as Mayor when extended and none of the residents were informed. However i can get within a few miles of their house (requires a bit of circumnavigating!) and park up at one of their friends house.

We have a 1996 Duetto, and its great. As said above, do check very carefully for rust, we didn't, and ended up with a huge bill. This does however mean that the van is (for now, at least) as good as new.

Re driving it; you are sat higher up so get a better view of whats going on ahead, but reversing is a bit harder. I usually ask my wife to see me back into spaces. 

The van fits into a normal car parking space width wise, but its a bit longer than your average space. You just need to choose your spot carefully.

Your van looks good value, as long as its sound rust wise.

I assume that spares will be easily available in Europe. Transits are pretty bulletproof mechanically (fingers crossed....) so would be ideal for long term travelling.

I still miss our Duetto. I am a Transit fan so it was an only choice when we bought our first van. Sadly the dreaded Ford tin worm caught us out. The Mk5  Duetto we had was based on the Turano, german built Transit with nice things like heated drivers seat. An engine that pulls like a train and not bad on fuel. If you havnt read my post about rust issues I will tell you were to check. Door pillars, scuttle under windscreen, door steps, side panel and floor  under water, rear door bottoms, floor at the front of the nearside rear spring ( under bathroom), front cross member under radiator, battery trays(screen water runs on to them). Having had all this repaired on ours and new curtains, I often wonder  were ours went(.N81 GFM). Some one got a good deal if the repairs were as good as the price we payed. 
The minor mechanical repairs that were needed to ours were roadside repairs or get home and sort later.

Checking online MOT history, this failed with some extensive rust/corrosion issues in June 2016, then passed with no advisories a month later.
It has clearly had a lot of work done, but will need thorough checks to make sure repairs were good and long lasting.
I am currently undergoing some welding repairs to my 1999 Duetto. I've had a lot done professionally, but with the costs I am doing the latest repairs myself. Sadly mine was badly bodged to look good when I bought it, but the corrosion soon reappeared.
Good luck.
Jollywalker

Ours had been stored in a barn. The barn roof was damaged in a storm leaking water on the n/s front corner. The door pillar was repaired as part of an insurance claim. When the body shop tried to replace the scuttle there was very little left of the bottom of the pillar. All this started with a cracked windscreen. 
I keep looking round our Rienza for any tell tale signs, hopefully I can keep on top of this one.

Regards rust issues on the Transit one spot nobody has mentioned which is pretty serious is under the battery trays. The reason it's serious is you won't ever see it until you remove the trays (similar to discovering the scuttle issue which lays hidden from view....usually until you need a screen replacement!).

Both trays sit on top of each inner wheel arch and the rusting is helped courtesy of Ford.....who when soundproofing the engine bay, covered the inner arches before bolting the trays on. That just acts as a sponge holding water to the metal starting the rust process. I knew about this from a previous Transit i'd owned which needed a new battery and when replacing, to my horror a sizeable chunk of inner arch came away! 

I managed to get it welded but when i bought my current Duetto, one of the first jobs i did was remove the trays and cut the soundproofing away. Before replacing i wire brushed both trays, painted with Hammerite, then waxoyled over the inner arch before bolting the trays back on.

May seem a bit over the top but everything metal there is still rock solid and rust free eight years on.

Thanks for all the info. my biggest concern about a diesel has been how ill be effected by low emmision zones ect. I was worried about depreciation as well, the more countries become hostile to diesel. I do live very close to the m25, and I don't know if I could drive to my dads in Twickenham, but I actually plan to leave traveling asap, without much intention of coming back soon.
The van im looking at appears to have had extensive work done, and they claim the guy who did the mot commented on how professional it was, but we could all say that... I was thinking of seeing if I could get the AA to give it a test. since I don't really know much about vans at all.

Anyone whos had a duetto from this time, whats a realistic mpg? I've seen anywhere from 28 to 35, is that what I can expect?

Anyone whos had a duetto from this time, whats a realistic mpg? I've seen anywhere from 28 to 35, is that what I can expect?

Troubadour wrote:Anyone whos had a duetto from this time, whats a realistic mpg? I've seen anywhere from 28 to 35, is that what I can expect?

Its directly proportional to how you drive.

As with all diesels, it's very dependent on type of journey. If you do mainly short journeys at town speeds it will be bad - mid twenties at best I would think. On long journeys when the engine is fully up to working temp, I would think you could see 35 MPG provided it's motorway type driving. Hills and lots of bends will obviously drag that down significantly.

Peter Brown wrote:

Troubadour wrote:Anyone whos had a duetto from this time, whats a realistic mpg? I've seen anywhere from 28 to 35, is that what I can expect?

Its directly proportional to how you drive.

Spot on.

You could have also included the word "fast" Peter.

It's amazing what a difference a 5mph headwind will make to a journey - particularly apparent when comparing the mpg "on the way there" when it was calm, to the consumption on the way back and against the wind.

A 5mph headwind is the same as driving 5mph faster. Q.E.D. 

Hi,
The main difference when driving a van is using the mirrors constantly to watch for people coming upinto your blind spots, the interior mirror is useless, also angle the nearside mirror down slightly so you can see the nearside rear wheel, makes reversing eaaier,
Chris

I did 1250miles last year, driving gently across to North Wales, on to Lake District, then Fort William, returning via Northumberland, Yorkshire, Lancashire, then steady run down M6.
Lots of slow, hilly and twisty roads, averaged 31mpg.
Mines the 2.5 turbo.
Jollywalker

Troubadour wrote:Thanks for all the info. my biggest concern about a diesel has been how ill be effected by low emmision zones ect. I was worried about depreciation as well, the more countries become hostile to diesel. I do live very close to the m25, and I don't know if I could drive to my dads in Twickenham, but I actually plan to leave traveling asap, without much intention of coming back soon.
The van im looking at appears to have had extensive work done, and they claim the guy who did the mot commented on how professional it was, but we could all say that... I was thinking of seeing if I could get the AA to give it a test. since I don't really know much about vans at all.

No you can't access Twickenham. My son lives in that locality but as previously mentioned i park my van at one of his friends who lives just outside and my son then picks me up. You can check here on a TfL site; [You must be registered and logged in to see this link.]

Regards depreciation the Duetto is highly sought after and as a panel van conversion (PVC), they hold their value extremely well, better than coachbuilt type vans (CB) due to low maintenance....no worries about water ingress/damp.

Second point you mentioned mpg. The Mk5 TDi will return around 30mpg on a long run fully laden driven at 55-60mph. You won't get more than that from that model with that engine. They are quite a heavy van and all the interior shelving/cupboards are made of solid wood, not mdf. 

Despite the LEZ, diesel engined m/homes and pvc's are far more sought after than petrol. In fact very few people will buy a petrol engine m/h. The longevity of the 2.5TDi is well known and often outlasts the vehicle. They may be a bit crude and almost 'agricultural' by comparison to current day engines....but they are virtually bullet proof.

Hello the duetto is a good choice parts are cheap just check for the rust Under the chassis  the wings and Under the carver cascade and the rear doors too and under    the steps  remove the plastic and have a look    about the MPG it's 30 . 35 MPG the weight   2560KG on the scale   the van is easy to drive not fast but reliable a little bit Noisy but it's easy to improve it   .mine just passed again the CT  french M O T and it's fine for two years.
regards
PASCAL

Well I was looking at mazda bongos for a while before I discovered autosleepers, and I was amazed that something as small as the mazda gets 19-24 mpg and these big heavy lwb vans get so much more out if their diesel

Troubadour wrote:Well I was looking at mazda bongos for a while before I discovered autosleepers, and I was amazed that something as small as the mazda  gets 19-24 mpg and these big heavy lwb vans get so much more out if their diesel

Looks like you're back to searching as that Duetto advertised on ebay sold on the 20th. You have to be really quick to go and view as they don't hang around for long...especially at this time of year.

But you need to decide exactly on make/model type you are going for and then concentrate only on that. Also budget limit is very important. And be prepared to travel.

It took me a few months of looking at Duetto's before i found one at the right price and in mint condition. I'd knocked up a fair bit of travel mileage too by both car and train and the day i discovered my Duetto, i'd just returned from viewing one at Folkestone....a round trip of 600 miles for me, which turned out to be another lemon! The one i bought was at Reading so that was another 300 mile round trip and i spotted the advert after returning from Folkestone. I was off first thing the following morning! 

Good luck in hunting and remember to come back to the forum and let us all know how you go on!

It is gone, and im having problems beucase I don't have access to a vehicle right now, so its hard to get anywhere, trains obviously a possibility, but costs an absolute fortune. Im looking at one in Lancashire right now, thats in having some work done, but that's 4 hours away from me unfortunately