Symphony, symbol, harmony…range differences

Hi I’m new to the forum, this is my first post.

I’ve been looking to buy a Motorhome for several months now, after lots of research I’ve taken a liking to the ( relatively ) old school Autosleeper Peugeot based van range ( around 95-2001 I believe ) I’ve come across models called Symphony, symbol and harmony so far ( are there more within this range?) 

I love the spec and haven’t seen anything else this compact size with such a high specification, with build quality that looks ‘old school Mercedes’ esq. I think the closest I’ve seen was the Richard holdworth conversions? also built on the Peugeot boxer but they don’t have the shower ( an essential for us ) 

I’m struggling to see the differences in spec between these 3 models, ( symbol, symphony and harmony ) can anyone tell me the differences, and which model has the highest spec. I really like the spec with boards that provide extra sleeping above instead of the cupboard.

I think I’d prefer a diesel only because I’m thinking the petrol version would be pretty thirsty? Please tell me if that’s not the case.

If anyone can help me with some ‘buyers guide’ tips on the most important things I should be looking at when viewing a potential purchase:

Structurally - where the tin worm likes to feed.

Mechanically - known weak points that are particularly expensive to repair?

Habitation fitments - What would you say are the most expensive things to repair replace if not working correctly?

Any advice would be very helpful indeed.

Hoping the prices will come down a little now things are slowly returning to normal, especially with the latest travel rules being lifted and the upcoming winter might be the best time to pick up something.

I do like the fibreglass monocoque models built on the Peugeot of this era too but seem to demand a higher price so the vans seem a good starting point for a newbie like myself.

Looking forward to read your responses and very excited to buy a van and start using it.

Many thanks
Paul

Hi Paul
Welcome to the forum from Bridington, lots of members with a wide range of models and experiences should be able to help answer some of your queries.
Once they are up.  
Boaby

Going from memory and not checking on old Literature, The Symbol is a modern version of the Symphony and the Harmony was a little bit smaller - I will stand correction on this.
Tin Worm - front cross members were the worst point
Check the gear box some folks have had problems getting these repaired and like most Peugeot Spares for the Boxer not available as new items.
Lots of these vans around and they give good service to their owners.

Hi Paul.  We have a 1998 Symphony and, as you say, the build quality is excellent.  The rust worm, however, has had a great time chewing away on the cills.  It's going in for some tlc soon - complete replacement of inner and outer cills on both sides and a couple of patches - one on the offside front wheel arch and another somewhere on the rear suspension.

The main difference between the Symphony and Symbol is that the Symphony is a 2 berth and the Symbol has an additional 2 berth bed on planks.  I know nothing about the Harmony.

Ensure that the water heater, space heater, fridge etc work properly and that there are no leaks in the bathroom when the water pump is switched on.  The push fit water connection for the shower is very difficult to get at and seems to be notorious for coming apart.

We have only owned our van for 5 months so can't comment on mechanical problems but it is a very well put together van, remarkably compact and surprisingly nice to drive.  Ours is the 2.0 petrol, which is under-powered and thirsty, but we don't go very far.  Stick with the diesel, we would in hindsight!  A great wee van, not without it's problems but given that it's 23 years old we can forgive that.

Paul

Symphony,  2 gas rings, Symbol 3 rings. Symbol has large Heki rooflight, Symphony smaller one. Harmony 2 rear forward facing seats, Symbol and Symphony only 1. Harmony has 2 gas rings and grill but no oven and is about 8" shorter. Symbol more modern sink , taps and worktops. Symbol replaced Symphony but we're both produced alongside each other for couple of years until older Symphony parts were used up.
There is also the Rambler, same length as Harmony but a different  layout, has toilet but not same washroom as the others.

thanks for all the replies guys, lots of good info, all very much appreciated. 

Ian many thanks for the info in your PM, I cant reply to it until I've posted 3 times.

The search continues.

How about the Topaz, full facilities, car like to drive, very well built, reliable.parts available even for the oldest ones.

I've got a brochure covering all 3 scanned in if needed.
Terry

newterry wrote:I've got a brochure covering all 3 scanned in if needed.
Terry

Hi Terry I’d be interested in taking a look how would I get a copy? 

Many thanks
Paul

Paul,
Send me a pm with your e-mail address and I'll send it over, already got it scanned in as part of my brochure library.
Terry

newterry wrote:Paul,
Send me a pm with your e-mail address and I'll send it over, already got it scanned in as part of my brochure library.
Terry

Thanks for the email Terry, very interesting read. Do you happen to know what the Harmony sold for when it was brand new? Just curious. 

When bought ours in April 1999 it was about £28000 but it was reduced to £24500 as a dealer day special offer. I since learnt that it was converted by AS in June 1998 so Berkshire Motorcaravans (subsequently became Marquus Berkshire) were keen to get it sold.
Having p/x it for an Executive in 2002 I was reunited with it in 2011, long story, and paid £15000.. Current valuation around £11-12000. I have spent about £10k on maintenance over the last 10 years to keep her in til top condition.
The only drawback is the 1.9td engine is a bit brearhless on steep hills.
Terry

newterry wrote:When bought ours in April 1999 it was about £28000 but it was reduced to £24500 as a dealer day special offer. I since learnt that it was converted by AS in June 1998 so Berkshire Motorcaravans (subsequently became Marquus Berkshire) were keen to get it sold.
Having p/x it for an Executive in 2002 I was reunited with it in 2011, long story, and paid £15000.. Current valuation around £11-12000. I have spent about £10k on maintenance over the last 10 years to keep her in til top condition.
The only drawback is the 1.9td engine is a bit brearhless on steep hills.
Terry

Hi Terry,

Well that sounds like a great vote of confidence for the Harmony model and nice to hear. 

The one we've purchased also has the 1.9TD engine and as yet I've only driven it back from down south up to Chesterfield, pretty much M1 motorway all the way so have yet to encounter any steep hills though I was pleasantly surprised with it's performance on the run back sitting comfortably between 60-70 MPH and seems pretty decent on fuel. 

It's not immaculate by a long stretch but has been serviced regular and has only covered 61K miles with the gearbox being reconditioned with a a new clutch fitted last month, so mechanically and interior wise its very good, just had some shoddy repairs on the bodywork which I'll improve over the coming months, but for the price we paid I'm more than happy.

One thing I'd like to ask you, on Sunday I fired up the gas blower heating, bearing in mind it was snowing outside. I set the thermostat up to about 3/4 and pushed the button twice to start the heater on low. I let it run for about 2 mins and when i put my hand in front of the blower vent it didn't feel warm so I pushed the button again for the higher heat setting and after a few seconds I could feel the air was warming. Should the blower be very gentle, is that how they are? You couldn't hear it in operation but you can feel a very very gentle breeze coming out the vent just wondered if that sounds normal. The leisure battery was showing green when i pushed the test button so I don't think the battery was lacking power. 

I'm also working to get the extra cushions ( 5 more in total ) to convert the bed to double which I've read was an optional extra when new. luckily the cushion dimensions are shown in the owner manual so I can get those made but the extra bridging piece of wood that sits between the cab seats will need sourcing or making. I don't suppose you have that yourself? If so if you could tell me the dimensions that would be marvellous and I'll have a go at making something.

Any Harmony ownership tips you have I'd also love to hear.

Many thanks Paul

Hi Paul,
My Harmony has done 85,000 on the clock, on motorways and A roads 65 mph seems to be sweet spot. I always use premium diesel which does add a bit of extra puff even though it costs an extra £6-7 per tankful plus 30mpg on a run. I've used standard for the last tankful because of the price hike.
When the road goes up and speed starts falling away, drop a gear sooner rather than hanging on. On the really steep stuff either give yourself some space to the vehicle in front to avoid getting baulked or drop into 1st gear at the bottom and keep up the momentum until the engine note changes cresting the climb. 
Thankfully I've got a good bodyshop man where the van is serviced plus a specialist not too far away.
My Carver Cascade and Rapide gave up the ghost a while ago so I've now got a Heatsource 2000 for heating and no 12v hot water so can't help on that query.
To make the double bed use the 2 tables which rest on ledges either side of the aisle except the near side wasn't fitted on mine so I used and upturned Really Useful Box with the small table on top and a few jointing blocks screwed into the underside to stop it moving.
We've reverted to single beds as getting up in the night is easier.
I've also carefully removed the bulkhead over the cab and replaced it with an AS cargo net which makes it easier to access whatever is up there. If I've got any photos I'll send them over on an e-mail.
We now use an inflatable awning which gives us some more space, it attaches to the slot on the edge of my Fiamma rollout awning.
We've used the Harmony throughout lockdowns where restrictions permitted as a self contained 'isolation unit' with on board loo, tea making and easy parking.
If I think of anything else I'll e-mail.
Terry

newterry wrote:Paul,
Send me a pm with your e-mail address and I'll send it over, already got it scanned in as part of my brochure library.
Terry

Hi Terry, I'd be really grateful if you could also send me the brochure(s) you are referring to, ideally to allow me to compare a Symphony, a Symbol and a Rambler.
Sadly, I need to replace my VW Talent and would like to see the layouts of these three for comparison.
I would PM you but I am new to the forum and haven't yet posted enough times!
Would you be able to PM me with an email address I could use please?
Thanks
Rowly

Hi Rowly,
I'll sort out the brochure and then pm you with my e mail address. It might have to come over in parts as my e-mail doesn't like big attachments.
Terry