Gas usage?

Hello everyone,

I have a 1999 Duetto and will be using it regularly to work away from home for 6 days a week for next few months. Can anyone advise on which gas is best? some say Propane all year round, others say Butane is better for campervans..?

Next question is how much should I expect to use roughly? It's just me in the van, I will have a shower once a day, use the oven once a day, hob twice a day for maybe 30 mins, run the fridge on gas, and will have the habitation air heater on for 1.5 hours before bed in the evenings.

Let me know some educated guesses.

Thanks

Daniel

Daniel - the advice on propane versus butane is pretty simple: If you expect to use the van when the ambient temp is below 5 degrees (give or take a bit) for any length of time, you should use propane. Butane doesn't evaporate quickly enough below that temp.

Usage is very hard to guess, because there are so many factors - e.g. if it's subzero outside you'll use a ~lot~ more gas in the heater than if it's 10 degrees outside! My own personal experience of a blown-air (Propex) heater is that it used a lot of gas. You'll be able to work it out for yourself fairly quickly - I would recommend that you start out with 2 full cylinders so you minimise the risk of running out before you've got a good idea of how to plan your supplies.

Roopert wrote:Daniel - the advice on propane versus butane is pretty simple: If you expect to use the van when the ambient temp is below 5 degrees (give or take a bit) for any length of time, you should use propane. Butane doesn't evaporate quickly enough below that temp.

Usage is very hard to guess, because there are so many factors - e.g. if it's subzero outside you'll use a ~lot~ more gas in the heater than if it's 10 degrees outside! My own personal experience of a blown-air (Propex) heater is that it used a lot of gas. You'll be able to work it out for yourself fairly quickly - I would recommend that you start out with 2 full cylinders so you minimise the risk of running out before you've got a good idea of how to plan your supplies.

Thank you. Its not quite that cold yet so Im hoping to not need more than 3.9kg of gas per week, ideally not more than 3 a month but that may be wishful thinking. I'd be happy if i only needed 3 x 3.9kg calor gas bottles a month.

My "educated guess" would be, you need mains electric hook-up  (EHU)
Keith

I expect you already know that Butane has higher energy density so is "better" but is less reliable at low winter temperatures.
I was never sure what the temperature was going to be so I always used Propane (safe option as you can be sure it is going to work) and I had no problems with it.
My current van uses LPG which is a blend of propane and butane. I wonder if LPG type blends can be got in 3.9Kg bottle form?

AutoSleepy_Don wrote:I expect you already know that Butane has higher energy density so is "better" but is less reliable at low winter temperatures.
I was never sure what the temperature was going to be so I always used Propane (safe option as you can be sure it is going to work) and I had no problems with it.
My current van uses LPG which is a blend of propane and butane. I wonder if LPG type blends can be got in 3.9Kg bottle form?

Good idea, i'll look into that.

KMRTOPAZ wrote:My "educated guess" would be, you need mains electric hook-up  (EHU)
Keith

Yes i agree, but I embarrassed to say I don't know (and doubt) that mains hook up will heat the air for the propex heater, or heat the water.

NewDuettoOwner wrote:
Yes i agree, but I embarrassed to say I don't know (and doubt) that mains hook up will heat the air for the propex heater, or heat the water.

It will depend on the exact spec of the van. You will probably have a Carver Cascade heater which should have an electric element for the water. I ~think~ the Propex had an electric heat option at one time, but yours won't have it (not enough space). However, a simple 1kW+ heater, convection type, oil-filled or not, will make the inside comfortable in anything other than arctic conditions, and it will save you a ~lot~ of money.

Roopert wrote:

NewDuettoOwner wrote:
Yes i agree, but I embarrassed to say I don't know (and doubt) that mains hook up will heat the air for the propex heater, or heat the water.

It will depend on the exact spec of the van. You will probably have a Carver Cascade heater which should have an electric element for the water. I ~think~ the Propex had an electric heat option at one time, but yours won't have it (not enough space). However, a simple 1kW+ heater, convection type, oil-filled or not, will make the inside comfortable in anything other than arctic conditions, and it will save you a ~lot~ of money.

I'll definitely look into that, thanks.

In our 2003 Duetto if in the UK we used Calor propane but as backup i could accommodate 907 and 901  Campiingaz refillable cylinders. If on the continent, mostly camping in France I switched over to Campingaz because in was widely available.

I'd converted our van to have a bulkhead 30mbar regulator and using bits from Gaslow it was easy to change cylinders. I also needed a Campingaz valve to screw into their cylinders.

Our van was manufactured during the changeover from individual cylinder regulators to having a single bulkhead regulator. Fortunately our gas appliances could work on 30mbar.

As others have said having EHU and electric space heating, your existing electric heater, small fan heater, small oil filled radiator, can reduce your gas consumption, as will using a small electric kettle.

Its very much how long is a ball of string I know.

Larger van and 2 up I do have recorded figures, full cooking and showering in the van. When its cold 1ltr per day.

Relaxez-Vous wrote:In our 2003 Duetto if in the UK we used Calor propane but as backup i could accommodate 907 and 901  Campiingaz refillable cylinders. If on the continent, mostly camping in France I switched over to Campingaz because in was widely available.

I'd converted our van to have a bulkhead 30mbar regulator and using bits from Gaslow it was easy to change cylinders. I also needed a Campingaz valve to screw into their cylinders.

Our van was manufactured during the changeover from individual cylinder regulators to having a single bulkhead regulator. Fortunately our gas appliances could work on 30mbar.

As others have said having EHU and electric space heating, your existing electric heater, small fan heater, small oil filled radiator, can reduce your gas consumption, as will using a small electric kettle.

thanks.

marconi wrote:Its very much how long is a ball of string I know.

Larger van and 2 up I do have recorded figures, full cooking and showering in the van. When its cold 1ltr per day.

1ltr of gas? i.e. 1kg?

We had a 1999 Duetto and went to the North Cape of Norway in it. The temperature at, "night" went so low that the water in the pipes under the van froze and we had to come down to sea level the next, "day" to thaw them out. We used propane, actually from the Norwegian company called Aga and this worked perfectly. The main point was that the Aga cylinders would not fit the rather small gas locker in the Duetto and so I modified the wardrobe before we left the UK in order to take the larger Aga bottles.

The wardrobe can be altered / adapted quite easily to take bigger bottles and this is another option for you to consider if mains electricity is not available.

Another point is that if you intend to continue with the small bottles that fit the existing gas locker, then Butane bottles hold 4.5 kg which gives you 0.6 kg per bottle more (1.2 kg for two) than just propane. If you do have mains electricity available and can use it for heating, then you will not have any gas vaporising problems and can gain the benefit of the greater capacity of butane bottles.

NewDuettoOwner wrote:

marconi wrote:Its very much how long is a ball of string I know.

Larger van and 2 up I do have recorded figures, full cooking and showering in the van. When its cold 1ltr per day.

1ltr of gas? i.e. 1kg?

1ltr is 0.5 kg

To answer the question: 1 kg of gas (either butane or propane) equates to about 2 litres of gas

Edit: looks like AutoSleepy Don and I have overlapped !

Across our ownership of the van, with about 2:1 on/off grid and used all year round, we're averaging about a litre (so 0.5kg) per night.

Spospe wrote:We had a 1999 Duetto and went to the North Cape of Norway in it. The temperature at, "night" went so low that the water in the pipes under the van froze and we had to come down to sea level the next, "day" to thaw them out. We used propane, actually from the Norwegian company called Aga and this worked perfectly. The main point was that the Aga cylinders would not fit the rather small gas locker in the Duetto and so I modified the wardrobe before we left the UK in order to take the larger Aga bottles.

The wardrobe can be altered / adapted quite easily to take bigger bottles and this is another option for you to consider if mains electricity is not available.

Another point is that if you intend to continue with the small bottles that fit the existing gas locker, then Butane bottles hold 4.5 kg which gives you 0.6 kg per bottle more (1.2 kg for two) than just propane. If you do have mains electricity available and can use it for heating, then you will not have any gas vaporising problems and can gain the benefit of the greater capacity of butane bottles.

thanks for the info.

Spospe wrote:To answer the question: 1 kg of gas (either butane or propane) equates to about 2 litres of gas

Edit: looks like AutoSleepy Don and I have overlapped !

Ok I understand.

Weegie wrote:Across our ownership of the van, with about 2:1 on/off grid and used all year round, we're averaging about a litre (so 0.5kg) per night.

Thanks, Im starting to get a rough idea of usage.