URGENT

Hi everyone I've just done a vehicle check on 1997 Duetto I'm picking up TOMORROW at a cost of £12.000 advertised at 68000 miles and the vehicle  check has come back at 98000 miles in 2005 I've rang the police for advice as I've put down £500 deposit and they said there is nothing I can do  i should have done a vehicle check before leaving a deposit and that it is a trading standards issue as it is with a dealer.  Has anybody any advice they could give us Thanks Sally

It seems that the dealer has (maybe inadvertently) given you incorrect mileage information. Now that the correct mileage is known you should be able either to 
negociate on the price, or ask for your deposit back.

If the 2005 mileage is correct it means that it has been driven over 12000 miles anually. This would be a high mileage for a motorhome and fairly unlikely although not impossible of course.

I wouldn't be in too much of a hurry to part with any cash until you're absolutely sure of the situation. If it has a service history you should be able to trace the mileage. Alternatively the previous owner will be on the V5C logbook and you could contact them. Annual mileage should also be on the MOT certificates.

If the dealer has given you incorrect mileage information they should return your deposit.

Good luck and let us know the outcome.

Have you done an online check of previous MOTs to see whether that backs up what the vehicle report says?

As nimbus says, 98k miles between 1997 and 2005 is relatively high, but not unknown for enthusiastic owners. It's also not at all unusual for vehicles to get clocked when they get close to 100,000 miles as it's a psychological barrier for many buyers.

The thing to do (if you're not already aware) is to keep things as pleasant and non-confrontational with the dealer for as long as possible, as he may be eager (if he suspects that there is something odd about the mileage) to do a good deal. Bear in mind that if it's a diesel those engines routinely go on for hundreds of thousands of miles, so higher than average mileage is not a disaster, as long as you're not paying a "low mileage" price!

Hi mojo what do you think would be a fair price as we wouldn't know what to offer!  And would you still buy it? Thanks

A little while ago I agreed a price and signed the contract for a new VW Passat after giving the dealer the spec off the website configurator. After getting home I rechecked the paperwork to note the dealer had put down a different version of the 2.0 liter engine I had specified (£1600 difference).
 
To be fair to the dealer, they admitted their mistake, said they could not offer the vehicle at the price we agreed and canceled the contract.
 
Seems a similar situation; in as much you have placed a deposit on a vehicle that was misrepresented, knowingly or otherwise.
 
The police won’t want to get involved in situations such as this (it’s a civil matter). I would suggest politely asking the seller to cancel the deal and refund your deposit, negotiate an acceptable price based on the discrepancy, or, as a last resort, take it up with Trading Standards.
 
   
Brian

Thanks for that Brian I will maybe see what he can offer Sally

It's almost impossible to advise on a fair price, because it depends so much on condition. It would be ~fairly~ unusual for a '97 van to have immaculate paintwork without the outer wings having been done, and that's not an issue if they have been done well. The thing that I would look for underneath is how extensively the underside has been covered with black underseal. From new they should be body-coloured paint underneath, so any solid black (as opposed to just dirty) is probably covering something*. The thing you really don't want is for the front inner wings (the part that the battery trays sit on in the engine compartment, above the front wheels) to have been bodged, as that can be really expensive to fix.

Have you checked the MOT history online yet? That may give you a clue as to what the real mileage is.

[*Edit: I should add that sometimes previous owners have the underside wax treated and this can occasionally be black which can confuse the issue - though most typically it will be almost clear.]

I'm presuming it's this one

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it is advertised as full history, so you should be able to verify whether mileage is 68 or 98 from the history together with past MOT's if they are there. It has been MOT'd 4 days ago. You can only calmly explain your fears and see if together you can verify the true mileage. Condition is everything, check it thoroughly if you decide you want it. Good luck.

First thing to do (assuming that is the vehicle on Ebay) is to take a hard copy of the advert. It may be possible to use this to negotiate a better price, or indeed back out altogether.

Having said that, it does look a tidy MH, it would be a shame to loose it. A real close look underneath ( as well as a good run out) would be the determining factor for me.

Brian

Very slightly off topic, my MOT tester brings up the previous years details ( & mileage) so wouldn't it be glaringly obvious when during the test the vehicle  shows, say 60k, but 'last' year was 90k??
So the way I see it, it IS a criminal offence (crooked tester) so the police SHOULD get involved, & what's the point of these 'laws' if they get away with it??

Of course, the MOT's might show all correct ascending mileages, in which case the previous OWNER had, or himself clocked it simply to be rid of it easier, in which case, the dealer missed it & it was his fault.

Yes that's the one I carn't get the full report as I don't have a v5c number or mot test number. Just done another car check on a different website and the last recorded mileage was 208.000 thousand miles so I'm just going to ring him and see if he can clarify the mileage with the service history or mot certificates and if not then ask him for our deposit back and hope he gives us it  Thanks to all of you for the advice. ☺

Every dealer I've ever dealt with does an Hpi check on every vehicle, so he should have picked this up himself. If that vehicle had already done 98k in 2005, then assuming light use of 3k per year since, it would now have covered somewhere in the region of 128k. Does it's condition show anything to make it look as if it has, worn pedal rubbers, heel area of carpet by pedals etc.?
Remember it's not illegal to clock a motor, only illegal to sell on without telling the buyer.

huckybear wrote:Yes that's the one I carn't get the full report as I don't have a v5c number or mot test number. Just done another car check on a different website and the last recorded mileage was 208.000 thousand miles so I'm just going to ring him and see if he can clarify the mileage with the service history or mot certificates and if not then ask him for our deposit back and hope he gives us it  Thanks to all of you for the advice. ☺

Just where do these car check sites get their information?  I reckon any motorhome with 208k on the clock would be showing serious signs of wear.

Be Nice and polite to the dealer whatever you do. Do NOT get angry. Decide what you want from him. Remember you have trading standards to fall back on. It might be a genuine mistake along the line somewhere. Good luck

Unfortunately I didn't check them sort of things. It was all painted black underneath though he said it had been under sealed (not so sure now whether that was to hide bad things)  

I know it's difficult to tell from photos at that resolution, but from what I can see the front O/s outer wing has been bodged. If you can see unevenness at that distance that suggests to me that it has not been done well (i.e. has been done with filler rather than cutting out and letting in a new panel).

I suspect your plan to ask for the deposit back is probably one you won't live to regret.

   Good luck - hope things work out for you.

Hi Huckybear 
Looking at the site for Kendle motor homes they have two duetto s listed a MK 5  1997 with 68k and a MK4  1995 with no mileage listed could some one of mixed up the details? 
Paul and Caz

How did you get on?

The question to be answered is if the mileage was 98,000 ten years ago, what is the actual mileage now? 

It's quite possible it has covered very little miles in that time but the MOT will show the figures. The MOT will go back the last 4 years and if it shows anywhere near 98,000+ then it has been clocked - walk away or negotiate hard.

High mileage isn't a bad thing on what is basically a commercial vehicle - I would far rather have a carefully used vehicle with a service history and constant use than one lying motionless for months at a time - tyres/bearings etc. don't take kindly to not being used.

My own T4 Clubman racked up high miles in the early part of its life but I know it was a retired couple who used it every week to tour Britain while they still had the time and energy to do so - 15,000 miles a year for four years! I bought it at 80 odd thousand miles and it was as fresh as a 30,000 miler I'd previously tested.

Don't be put off by the big mileage, as long as the service history can be justified and priced accordingly. High mileages on the Continent are the norm, the British "island mentality" of low being good is misplaced in my opinion. Good luck, I feel your angst!

Is it possible that the mileage is actually 168,000? Between 1997 and 2005 (8 years) it did 12,250 per year. High mileage - but not if they were also using it as a main vehicle. It would not be unreasonable for the mileage to be correct at 168,000 as this would equate to 70,000, or 7,000 per year. If this is so, I feel that there would be a good case for a major price reduction.

If you read the posters update above the latest vehicle check showed 208k miles. So why did the first check show 98k. Surely these checking companies use the same information from the DVLA. I'm inclined to think a mistake in the records somehow. I'm sure the dealer would have done his own hpi check when he took it in.

If the van has actually done 208k miles, its possible it has had more than one engine? Check engine Serial number on unit and documents.
If you can view the service history, check to see what parts have been replaced during its years of use, a vehicle of that age and mileage will have gone through more than one set of brakes, clutch etc.
Looking forward to read how you got on with the dealer.
Boaby

Waiting with interest on this one, what was the result?