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Major fresh water leak

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Post by DannyC Sun Feb 19, 2023 11:19 am

Using our Symbol over winter, we didn't drain the tank before really cold snap, I Know ***!!, now trying to locate a leak in the system.
When I turned on the Shureflo water pump at the control the pump kept running and no water came out of the tap. 
Turned the control switch off and noticed water running out underneath. The water kept running out, above the lower floor section at the side door. It seemed like the pump had set off a syphoning effect and the water flowed until the tank was empty.
Attempting to find the leak.
I can follow red and blue hoses to the main sink which seems ok. Have been trying to follow the output rubber hoses to the toilet sink and shower. 
These hoses head off behind or under the fridge and wondered I'm missing an access hatch or do I need to take out the fridge etc.
 
Does anyone know where the hot water tank might be located and how it is accessed? 
Cheers
Hope ive explained this ok.
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Post by AutoSleepy_Don Sun Feb 19, 2023 11:28 am

DannyC wrote:
Does anyone know where the hot water tank might be located and how it is accessed? 

On my 2002 Symbol, the hot water tank (boiler) was in a boxed section under the sofa
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Post by FreelanderUK Sun Feb 19, 2023 12:10 pm

Welcome to the Forum

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Post by Bilbobaggins Sun Feb 19, 2023 12:26 pm

Have you checked filter cup on pump, well known for cracking if get iced up

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Post by Paulmold Sun Feb 19, 2023 1:38 pm

You say you didn't drain it before cold snap, did you drain it at all?
Do you have Carver hot tank or Truma?

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Post by Bilbobaggins Mon Feb 20, 2023 2:29 pm

Can't be that serious, OP hasn't logged on since original message, another time waster shrugg

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Post by AutoSleepy_Don Mon Feb 20, 2023 2:41 pm

Bilbobaggins wrote:Can't be that serious, OP hasn't logged on since original message, another time waster shrugg

I say this based on the assumption he will not return.  Major fresh water leak 1f600
If the "Cold Snap" the OP refered to, was the period in December when it was sub zero for 2 weeks solid (even here in the South of England) then I fear the worst for this chap.

I have some 50L builders tubs full of rain water in back garden and they froze solid.
Ice cubes 3ft x 3ft x 3ft solid ice all the way through, not just a thin layer on the surface.
If that doesn't destroy the boiler, pump + everything then what would?
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Post by DannyC Thu Feb 23, 2023 12:04 pm

Hi Folks
Thanks for the responses to my first post. Sorry haven't had the time to log back on, got diverted by work and had to replace starter motor. 
Partly through embarrassment and fear of the ribbing i deserve for not draining the system before that arctic blast hit us I may have been reluctant to check back in.
Have accessed the Sureflo pump and the rubber pipework to main sink and where it splits to go to toilet sink and shower, will check to the hot water tank *thanks for the suggestion on that and the strainer cup on the pump* I'm struggling with how to check the pipework from the split as it goes behind/under the fridge. Any inspection hatches for that as it looks like a dismantling  units and would the fridge need to come out??
Its the way it seems to syphon the tank if i try the pump and switch it off. There are no signs of wet patches inside.
Would welcome any thoughts.
Will put up a photo of my symbol when i work out how.
Cheers
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Post by Askit Thu Feb 23, 2023 1:40 pm

Danny, I would hazard a guess that we've all made errors on here (I certainly have) so no need to be embarrassed.. I don't know your van layout, so can't help with that, but from your description of the water running under the van I wanted to ask if it might be an issue with the dump valve being open?

Apologies if I'm teaching my mother's mother to suck eggs.

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Post by Paulmold Thu Feb 23, 2023 1:55 pm

Removing the fridge vents might give some access from outside. You haven't answered if you have Carver or Truma water heater, that may help as to what drain valve you have.

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Post by DannyC Sat Feb 25, 2023 3:44 pm

Hi folks

It is a carver water heater. Have confirmed the leak is there. How do I access the tank. The box under bed only has a hatch to get to reset button. Propex heater sits on top of box accessed by inspection hatch under bed. 
Does the side wall off that box come off ??
Feel I'm getting there. Thanks for the help. Cheers Dannyc
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Post by Paulmold Sat Feb 25, 2023 4:52 pm

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Post by DannyC Sun Feb 26, 2023 9:12 am

Thanks Paul thats a great healp will let you know how it goes. Cheers
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Post by Spoonvet Sun Feb 26, 2023 9:13 am

Great link there from Paulmold, I removed mine a few years ago to fix a leak, fairly ok job - I did destroy the electric loom at the base accidentally, doesn't worry me as happy to use gas.
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Post by DannyC Sun Feb 26, 2023 9:30 am

Nice one will try to keep my eye on the wiring. Cheers folks much appreciated. Dannyc
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Post by DannyC Mon Feb 27, 2023 10:14 am

Hi Folks
Had the carver tank out over the weekend. Checked hot and cold water connectors,, both good, black version, and cut back hoses to reconnect.
Didn't take the pressure valve or drain plug out, both white-ish, reconnected and refilled system. Water leaking from bottom of the heater unit onto the electric control box. Concerned that it is a crack in the tank itself. Not sure if pressure release valve or drain plug could be causing that.
You were right that its a tight space to work in and not tangle the hoses or wires.
Any further ideas on finding the culprit.
Could i be looking at new tank?
cheers
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Post by jerry Mon Feb 27, 2023 12:50 pm

Had frost problem with my water heater , the large  O ring at the van wall end wasn't sealing . frost damage caused the other end where tank bolted together to  dish stopping the seal working properly ,I cured my issue  with a  2x2 inserted inside tank base of tank on plywood sharp tap with lump hammer.  Im not suggesting you carry out this procedure. 
Purchased  new o rings from fleabay . I didnt realise that the waterheater had to be drained separately as well as the under slung . 

Can frost protection valves be retrofitted  to these old boilers.

Thanks

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Post by Spoonvet Mon Feb 27, 2023 1:29 pm

I replaced all seals and bits when I had my tank apart - just to be safe. I struggled to get a good deal on the base where the element goes in - I think I used a engine sealant in the end! 

There are complete kits or tanks on ebay, someone on there will also refurnish.
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Post by DannyC Wed Mar 01, 2023 8:52 am

Much appreciated folks I'm really chuffed with all the comments and help. Now that I know where the problem is I'm happy to work through the tips to fix it.
I've ordered an O-ring sealing kit to try. Will update later.
Cheers
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Post by DannyC Sun Mar 05, 2023 9:56 am

Hi Folks
After I dismantled the water heater discovered the end of the tank is cracked and will not seal. Think there may have been a repair attempted in the past as there was so much gritty gunge inside and a lot of the internal casing was flaked off. Holes to the side of the connector rod where it bolts together. Think its an E-bay search for a replacement unit there seem to be a few and reasonable price so fingers crossed for a good one. Sorry but not worked out how to post photos on the posts yet.
Cheers
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Post by Paulmold Sun Mar 05, 2023 10:11 am

Instructions for photos can be found in the Factsheets (half way down on homepage).

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Post by Spoonvet Sun Mar 05, 2023 10:22 am

All a learning curve, I think within a year I had fixed my fridge, the water system and the blown air system - def helps to get to know your van. Plenty of units on eBay so hope you get sorted.
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Post by DannyC Sun Mar 05, 2023 10:24 am

Cheers Paul
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Post by inspiredron Sun Mar 05, 2023 11:11 pm

jerry wrote:
Can frost protection valves be retrofitted  to these old boilers.

Thanks
Can't see any difficulty in fitting a manual drain valve but surprised that there isn't already one there. You'd just have to fit the valve in the cold water feed to the hot tank at a point where it runs along the floor and you can drill a suitable hole through the floor. Manual valves are about £40 - automatic one is over £150 and needs more space. Both can be found on Amazon.

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Post by DannyC Mon Mar 27, 2023 10:21 am

Hi Folks
Just to update on the Carver GE hot water tank leak.
Sent the tank off to Gary Baker at Sunset Caravans on a Monday, needed new tank and gas burner etc, got it back Thursday same week refurbished and tested.
Back together that weekend and alls good. Bit of flaky stuff coming through the hot water tap but hope that will clear with time.

Thanks for the help getting to the root cause and all the tips on how to solve it.
Cheers
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