Tracker Low Battery Warning

by MJF Fri 18 Nov 2022 - 13:02

I have had an Email notification from Asmonitor that my Leisure battery alert has been triggered, I have been to the storage site and both batteries were showing 12.2V, I've now brought the vehicle home and put it on hook up and it is charging nicely. I was hoping that the solar panel 'intelligent' split charge would keep both batteries charged but that is apparently not the case. I'd appreciate any advice on how to deal with this apparent problem, the only drain on the battery as far as I know is the tracker and the vehicle went for a 30 mile run 2 weeks ago. A larger solar panel is not an option as the roof is full up as we have an A/C unit.

Mark

by IanH Fri 18 Nov 2022 - 13:49

The best, by far, way to use your solar is to:-
1 buy a dual battery solar controller, Photonic Universe
2 Buy 2 x inline fuses 12v Planet
3 Fit the controller handy for both batteries, I put mine under the driver seat by the LB
4 Using 15A at least wire, connect the solar controller to , first, the LB with the inline fuse right at the LB +ve terminal.
5 Ditto for the starter battery its under the passenger feet floor, real easy to run wires under the flooring to/from the solar controller.
6 Take the wires from the solar panel and using inline crimps extend them to get to the new solar controller.
7 Connect them to the solar input terminals of the controller, be very careful re polarity
All will then work seemlessly and bypass any thing with Sargent written on it, always, IMHO a good thing!
The batteries will now be independent and the controller will look after them for you you can select the proportion of power to each battery, we use 20/80, 20% to the starter, 80% to the LB, in your newer van case with parasitic loads from the ECU, I'd use 40/60.

Couple pics of our Warwick Duo installation, bear in mind we also fitted the solar panel and cable gland, in that case the wires form the panel ran behind the microwave, we also had the excellent remote display, seen in 2nd pic....
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by MJF Fri 18 Nov 2022 - 14:27

Thanks for that very comprehensive information, I really don't want (or know how) to make any modifications to an almost new vehicle, I'll just have to nip up to the storage site and recharge the batteries when I get the nod from Asmonitor.

by glyne lock Fri 18 Nov 2022 - 14:34

IanH wrote:The best, by far, way to use your solar is to:-
1 buy a dual battery solar controller, Photonic Universe
2 Buy 2 x inline fuses 12v Planet
3 Fit the controller handy for both batteries, I put mine under the driver seat by the LB
4 Using 15A at least wire, connect the solar controller to , first, the LB with the inline fuse right at the LB +ve terminal.
5 Ditto for the starter battery its under the passenger feet floor, real easy to run wires under the flooring to/from the solar controller.
6 Take the wires from the solar panel and using inline crimps extend them to get to the new solar controller.
7 Connect them to the solar input terminals of the controller, be very careful re polarity
All will then work seemlessly and bypass any thing with Sargent written on it, always, IMHO a good thing!
The batteries will now be independent and the controller will look after them for you you can select the proportion of power to each battery, we use 20/80, 20% to the starter, 80% to the LB, in your newer van case with parasitic loads from the ECU, I'd use 40/60.

Couple pics of our Warwick Duo installation, bear in mind we also fitted the solar panel and cable gland, in that case the wires form the panel ran behind the microwave, we also had the excellent remote display, seen in 2nd pic....
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You are trying to help Ian but it needs to be MPPT solar controller for A EC500 OR EC700 system

by MJF Fri 18 Nov 2022 - 14:41

This is my control panel[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.]

by glyne lock Fri 18 Nov 2022 - 14:46

The main box in your camper MJF is s as ec700

by FreelanderUK Fri 18 Nov 2022 - 14:50

Buy a battery master which will keep the starter battery topped up , if you turned of the control panel and the main control box I am sure it will also stop the solar charging the batteries, the best way is to fit a new solar regulator and completely bypass the Sargent set up

by IanH Fri 18 Nov 2022 - 16:19

Glyne,
Not if bypassing all the Sargent bits IMHO
The way described above has been faultless on 5 different trucks now, 2 were Warwick duo???

by IanH Fri 18 Nov 2022 - 16:22

MJF.
How will you charge them at the storage site? EHU I'd hope?
Certainly not by running engine I sincerely hope!

by HJA Fri 18 Nov 2022 - 16:34

We are fortunate enough to have our van at home. We are not using the van over winter. About once a week I check the batteries (hab & cab). The solar (120w) has been doing OK so far. The van is on the south side of the house and unshaded, so get max it can at present. We are not going to get much solar from now on. From last year's experience. about every two weeks it needs a day on hook up to keep things charged. We also try & take it for a run, about 30/40 mins each way, to make sure all the "engine bits" get working.
Our control panel is turned off, so as far as I know only the tracker is pulling any power.
Our previous van had a sargent control panel like yours and I dont remember leaving it turned on.

by glyne lock Fri 18 Nov 2022 - 16:51

IanH wrote:Glyne,
Not if bypassing all the Sargent bits IMHO
The way described above has been faultless on 5 different trucks now, 2 were Warwick duo???

If you don’t use a mppt controller with a ec500 or ec700 gives problems as members here have found out and have had to change to a mppt controller
Yes even when you bypass the Sargent as needs doing to do an up grade mod to the great sales man solar system
The other older sergent system that you have fitted the controller as you have said may have worked ok for you. but when fitted to the ec500 makes the Sargent control panel Shutdown

by MJF Fri 18 Nov 2022 - 17:15

IanH wrote:MJF.
How will you charge them at the storage site? EHU I'd hope?
Certainly not by running engine I sincerely hope!

Drive home, about 2 miles away and charge on hookup. We live in a private development that doesn't allow parking of caravans/MH etc. on a permanent basis but OK for short periods so I'll just wait for the prompt from tracker.

by IanH Fri 18 Nov 2022 - 17:44

MJF.

Good!
Nothing or hardly anything is worse for a modern diesel as running at virtually zero load just to charge batteries.
I'd make the drive to, from home 10 or more miles to get the engine properly warmed

by Caraman Fri 18 Nov 2022 - 17:51

MJF - I've never received an e-mail/SMS battery voltage text alert so I can only go on what it says in the AS Monitor User Guide which is that the alert will be sent if the voltage of either battery drops below 11.3V or rises above 15.4V. If you received an alert for your leisure battery when it was 12.2V there is something wrong which you should follow up with Sargent or your dealer. However, it is my belief that these alerts will only be sent if the EC700 is not shutdown. In storage at this time of year, if your EC700 is not shutdown using its black shutdown button, it will flatten your leisure battery and then your vehicle battery. You must shutdown your EC700. In this way all the solar charge will go to your vehicle battery which should be enough to keep it fully charged. No charge will go to your leisure battery but if it is fully charged to start with it should be fine without charge for up to 3 months. Its only load will be the tracker which is very low.

When the EC700 is shutdown you can still see 6 hourly snapshots of your leisure battery voltage under Locate on AS Monitor. You should not allow your battery voltage to drop as low as 11.3V as it will shorten its life so leaving the EC700 on and waiting for a battery alert is not the right answer.

by v8oholic Fri 18 Nov 2022 - 18:13

I have had low leisure battery alerts twice (once when the 20A fuse blew), both times jointly by SMS and a phone call from the control centre. Both times the control centre started by telling me on the phone it was because the leisure battery was below a 12.0V threshold. I did query if that was right because it seemed high, but was told that’s what the system was set to, and it couldn’t be changed. I still have the alert texts, but they don’t mention the voltage threshold unfortunately.

Perhaps a battery at 12.2V could drop to 12.0V on a cold night, and recover again when it warms up. I have noticed the voltage is often lower at night than during the day.

by Paulmold Fri 18 Nov 2022 - 18:23

Wasn't there something about changing the setting to Fiat instead of Peugeot because the threshold on Fiat is lower?

Found it - mentioned in this thread

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by v8oholic Fri 18 Nov 2022 - 18:33

I don’t know quite what to make of that as mine has been hovering around 12.2-12.3V for a couple of weeks, and it hasn’t triggered an alert. I don’t remember seeing that setting in the EC700 advanced settings.

by Caraman Fri 18 Nov 2022 - 18:35

v8oholic wrote:I have had low leisure battery alerts twice (once when the 20A fuse blew), both times jointly by SMS and a phone call from the control centre. Both times the control centre started by telling me on the phone it was because the leisure battery was below a 12.0V threshold. I did query if that was right because it seemed high, but was told that’s what the system was set to, and it couldn’t be changed. I still have the alert texts, but they don’t mention the voltage threshold unfortunately.

Perhaps a battery at 12.2V could drop to 12.0V on a cold night, and recover again when it warms up. I have noticed the voltage is often lower at night than during the day.

Sargent has told me that disconnecting the 20A in-line leisure battery fuse should not generate the e-mail/SMS alert as it won't trigger if the voltage drops below 2V. However, it will generate a Thatcham theft event leisure battery alert from the manned tracking centre resulting in a phone call. I guess this Thatcham alert is only generated by the tracker when it is forced to use its internal battery. If the leisure battery voltage drops to the extent that it can no longer power the tracker it should trigger the Thatcham alert. I don't know how low the voltage must drop to trigger this Thatcham alert but discussion with Sargent suggests it is quite low and not to be confused with the 11.3V threshold for the SMS/e-mail AS Monitor alert. The SMS/e-mail AS Monitor leisure battery voltage alert is different to the Thatcham manned tracking centre leisure battery alert. They have different parameters.

by glyne lock Fri 18 Nov 2022 - 18:38

On the fiat it is a lower voltage the the controller gives off a alarm
When the battery voltage gets low the tracker sends a alarm for low voltage and you get contacted

by v8oholic Fri 18 Nov 2022 - 18:48

Caraman wrote:
v8oholic wrote:I have had low leisure battery alerts twice (once when the 20A fuse blew), both times jointly by SMS and a phone call from the control centre. Both times the control centre started by telling me on the phone it was because the leisure battery was below a 12.0V threshold. I did query if that was right because it seemed high, but was told that’s what the system was set to, and it couldn’t be changed. I still have the alert texts, but they don’t mention the voltage threshold unfortunately.

Perhaps a battery at 12.2V could drop to 12.0V on a cold night, and recover again when it warms up. I have noticed the voltage is often lower at night than during the day.
Sargent has told me that disconnecting the 20A in-line leisure battery fuse should not generate the e-mail/SMS alert as it won't trigger if the voltage drops below 2V. However, it will generate a Thatcham theft event leisure battery alert from the manned tracking centre resulting in a phone call. I guess this Thatcham alert is only generated by the tracker when it is forced to use its internal battery. If the leisure battery voltage drops to the extent that it can no longer power the tracker it should trigger the Thatcham alert. I don't know how low the voltage must drop to trigger this Thatcham alert but discussion with Sargent suggests it is quite low and not to be confused with the 11.3V threshold for the SMS/e-mail AS Monitor alert. The SMS/e-mail AS Monitor leisure battery voltage alert is different to the Thatcham manned tracking centre leisure battery alert. They have different parameters.

I don’t know quite how it works, but the leisure battery was fully charged at the time. I started the engine on a garage forecourt and got the warning text immediately. While checking the EC700 display (before realising it was a blown fuse) it reported both vehicle and leisure battery voltage as 0V. I was panicking at this point as I was a week into a 30 day trip in Germany and I thought the EC700 had failed or something serious. Anyway, once I realised the fuse had blown and replaced it, both batteries showed fully charged again. The phone call came about 15 minutes later. Perhaps removing or blowing the fuse when the engine is running has a different effect to removing it when it’s not.

The other time was more straightforward, when the solar panel wasn’t working it dropped to 12.0V and they contacted me.

They have never sent me an email, even though it's enabled on my account in ASMonitor. Just SMS and voice calls.

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by Caraman Fri 18 Nov 2022 - 19:40

The mysteries of Sargent and its tracker. I haven't pulled my 20A LB fuse for a while and I've learnt to do it now with the EC700 shutdown and Inhibit Service mode activated on AS Monitor. When I forgot to do either I only received the phone call from the manned tracking centre in Bedford. Sargent in Beverley explained the lack of SMS/e-mail from AS Monitor (which isn't the same as the manned tracking centre) was because the voltage had dropped below 2V.

This complexity is all a bit off-topic. The OP's problem I am sure is he hasn't shutdown his EC700 which he would still have to do if he carried out the solar regulator mod.

by v8oholic Fri 18 Nov 2022 - 20:25

And yet, I got an SMS alert with the leisure battery fuse blown, which is definitely below 2V. I think how it works in practice, and how Sargent may tell you, or even document, are possibly two entirely different things. You’re right, it’s not really relevant to the original issue, apart from the possibility it could be triggered by colder overnight temperature dropping the voltage temporarily to 12V.

The thing with a new van under warranty is you’re reluctant to make physical changes, so I expect occasional EHU or a regular decent length drive will be required. I do both myself.

by Suppersready Fri 18 Nov 2022 - 20:52

MJF wrote:Thanks for that very comprehensive information, I really don't want (or know how) to make any modifications to an almost new vehicle, I'll just have to nip up to the storage site and recharge the batteries when I get the nod from Asmonitor.

I would not want my batteries dropping to 12.2v on a regular basis before re charge as it will eat into the their cyclic life.

by IanH Fri 18 Nov 2022 - 21:19

My basic values are 12.7 to 12.8v fully charged, 12.2 v discharged.
Others may disagree, but that's been my teaching.................

by RogerThat Sat 19 Nov 2022 - 19:28

MJF wrote:I was hoping that the solar panel 'intelligent' split charge would keep both batteries charged

I don't know where you park the van but it hasn't stopped raining here for about five weeks straight.

You might simply not be getting enough sun these last couple of weeks?

Tracker Low Battery Warning

Tracker Low Battery Warning

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