Resetting Tyre Pressure Monitoring System

The question of tyre pressures has often been discussed on this forum, suffice to say that having weighed my Broadway and checked with Continental I reduced the front pressures from 5 bar to around 4 bar. In fact, I could go down to 3.25 bar. The improvement in ride quality has been staggering but, of course, the tyre pressure warning light is now permanently on.

So, when it was in for MOT I asked whether the pressures could be reset. They said that it was done but it didn’t work so this week I took it too a garage that had the correct Peugeot diagnostic software. They seemed to know what they were doing and could see the pressures but after 45 minutes told me that the ECU was not communicating with the computer in relation to that parameter so they were unable to change the settings.

This is a 2016 Boxer. Does anybody know whether there pressures can be reset.

Had my Nuevo reset by my dealer or at least they said they done it and had no further light on problem.
In fact it was free but the dealership managing director is my son, haven’t got Neuvo now . I have a New Fairford now but no problems.
JohnDean

Read through this.....

https://www.autosleeper-ownersforum.com/t14872-tyre-pressure-monitoring-system-tpms#120434

The Peugeot garage in Penrith reset mine on the Nuevo to lower pressures.  I had to sign some kind of disclaimer. (The vehicle is too high for both Kendal and Morecambe Peugeot garages)

I expect the info is on here someplace, but when did Peugeot start fitting TPMS, our van I assume was a 2015 build, reg 2016 does not have it fitted, or if it has I have never seen any notification.
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Richard

I assume we are talking about adjusting the TPMS so that it does not trigger when the tyre pressure is deliberately lowered.  I have approached 3 Peugeot dealers and all have refused to do it.  The Peugeot and DVSA line is that it is for the vehicle converter to re-plate the tyre pressures in consultation with the tyre manufacturer and have the TPMS adjusted before the motorhome leaves the factory.  Auto-Sleepers has failed to do this.  This means we are forced to use our motorhomes with overinflated front tyres, in my case by 67%. I have been in communication with Auto-Sleepers about this since February and had a face to face with them at Willersey two days ago.  They are meeting with their homologation contractor to see what can be done.  In the meantime, the more owners that raise this issue with Auto-Sleepers the better.

Paulmold wrote:Read through this.....

https://www.autosleeper-ownersforum.com/t14872-tyre-pressure-monitoring-system-tpms#120434

Thanks for the link which I seem to recall seeing a while back. It seems that one or two people have managed to get the TPMS reset but the advice I was given was that it wasn’t possible on my vehicle which is a little later than those mentioned on the thread. The first garage had an ODB-11 interface and thought they had done it, the specialist had the correct Peugeot diagnostic software and couldn’t do it. He said that the ECU wasn’t communicating with the BIM (?). Looks like I am stuck with it although I might think about getting in touch with a main dealer.

BornAgain wrote:

Paulmold wrote:Read through this.....

https://www.autosleeper-ownersforum.com/t14872-tyre-pressure-monitoring-system-tpms#120434

Thanks for the link which I seem to recall seeing a while back. It seems that one or two people have managed to get the TPMS reset but the advice I was given was that it wasn’t possible on my vehicle which is a little later than those mentioned on the thread. The first garage had an ODB-11 interface and thought they had done it, the specialist had the correct Peugeot diagnostic software and couldn’t do it. He said that the ECU wasn’t communicating with the BIM (?). Looks like I am stuck with it although I might think about getting in touch with a main dealer.

Some owners have reported difficulty in clearing the TPMS alarm after they have re-inflated their tyres.  I assume this is not what we are talking about.  The current Boxers can have their TPMS adjusted to trigger at a lower pressure but it has to be done as part of the conversion to a motorhome by the converter.

BornAgain wrote: .... but, of course, the tyre pressure warning light is now permanently on.  So, when it was in for MOT I asked whether the pressures could be reset. ....

A fully functioning TPMS is mandatory.  If the vehicle is run with the TPMS permanently triggered i.e. with the warning light on, it is not considered to be fully functioning as it will not detect any further reduction in tyre pressure and therefore should fail its MOT.

I can’t see it failing its MOT as I would simply need to inflate the tyres to the higher pressure prior to the test.

Caraman wrote:
A fully functioning TPMS is mandatory.  If the vehicle is run with the TPMS permanently triggered i.e. with the warning light on, it is not considered to be fully functioning as it will not detect any further reduction in tyre pressure and therefore should fail its MOT.

This is true, although there is nothing to stop you from arriving at the MOT test station, inflating the tyres to the right pressure to cause the TPMS light to go out, and then changing the pressures again once the MOT test was complete.

Provided you have reasonable evidence to show that the tyre pressure being used on the road is appropriate and safe, that would be completely legal, as far as I'm aware. A pain to have to do, but at least you could continue to pass the MOT until the issue was resolved.

Roopert wrote:

Caraman wrote:
A fully functioning TPMS is mandatory.  If the vehicle is run with the TPMS permanently triggered i.e. with the warning light on, it is not considered to be fully functioning as it will not detect any further reduction in tyre pressure and therefore should fail its MOT.

This is true, although there is nothing to stop you from arriving at the MOT test station, inflating the tyres to the right pressure to cause the TPMS light to go out, and then changing the pressures again once the MOT test was complete.

Provided you have reasonable evidence to show that the tyre pressure being used on the road is appropriate and safe, that would be completely legal, as far as I'm aware. A pain to have to do, but at least you could continue to pass the MOT until the issue was resolved.

I agree the MOT but not sure about the rest.  If you run a vehicle with its TPMS permanently triggered then in effect you no longer have a working TPMS.  This places you between a rock and a hard place - no TPMS but correctly inflated front tyres or a working TPMS but incorrectly inflated front tyres.  The answer is to have a working TPMS and correctly inflated tyres which Auto-Sleepers are stopping from happening.

But of course, you would be on your way to get the tyres inflated, having only just noticed the TPMS warning!

  What am I saying!!!! 

Why does the TPMS need to 'mandatorially working'...its just an 'extra' so is it no different to (say) a faulty satnav?
If I bought a £20 TPMS from eBay and it gave up the ghost I'd be under no obligation to get it fixed or removed, would I??

BornAgain wrote:

Paulmold wrote:Read through this.....

https://www.autosleeper-ownersforum.com/t14872-tyre-pressure-monitoring-system-tpms#120434

Thanks for the link which I seem to recall seeing a while back. It seems that one or two people have managed to get the TPMS reset but the advice I was given was that it wasn’t possible on my vehicle which is a little later than those mentioned on the thread. The first garage had an ODB-11 interface and thought they had done it, the specialist had the correct Peugeot diagnostic software and couldn’t do it. He said that the ECU wasn’t communicating with the BIM (?). Looks like I am stuck with it although I might think about getting in touch with a main dealer.

BornAgain,
You spurred me into action on a wet day.  I have just been to three independent garages in Salisbury who work on Boxers and have the software/diagnostic tools to do so.  Two said they couldn't adjust the TPMS and third doubted they could.  All three recommended it be done at a main dealer.  I have already approached three main dealers at Hamble, Devizes and Basingstoke who can adjust the TPMS but will only do so if Auto-Sleepers re-plates the vehicle which is what they should have done as part of the conversion.  I wish you luck when you go to a main dealer.  Unlike your motorhome, mine is under warranty so I am determined that Auto-Sleepers sorts it out.  Auto-Sleepers' local Peugeot dealer where they have to go is just off the M5 at Tewksbury.  I shall be happy to go there to get the TPMS adjusted but Auto-Sleepers will have to make it happen because I can't.  This won't help those who live at the other end of the Country.

bolero boy wrote:Why does the TPMS need to 'mandatorially working'...its just an 'extra' so is it no different to (say) a faulty satnav?
If I bought a £20 TPMS from eBay and it gave up the ghost I'd be under no obligation to get it fixed or removed, would I??

A satnav isn't a mandatory safety device but a TPMS is on new vehicles.  If you have an older vehicle without a TPMS and you then fit it with a TPMS, it doesn't have to work.

Am I right to assume that your PSA based Carthago has a TPMS that has been adjusted by the converter to allow the full range of front tyre pressures to be used as recommended by Continental?

Thanks for that Caraman; it was very helpful.  It does beg the question of what AS would plate to. Perhaps the maximum axle load but that's inflexible if you are running lower and would probably depend on tyre type. My Broadway is plated 5 bar front 5.5 bar rear but at my maximum load (from a weigh bridge) I should be running at 3.25/5.25.  This is a massive difference at the front and the ride quality at the lower pressure is a big improvement. As it seems difficult to persuade a main dealer to modify I think I shall just live with the panel warning. At least the low pressure is flagged up when the ignition is switched on and it gives the actual pressures so you can see if there is a problem.

I am still puzzled that the local specialist (Citroen dealer but he had Peugeot software on his laptop) could read all the figures but was still unable to get the system to accept the change.  Of course, he wouldn't have needed a waiver from AS nor an 'elf & safety certificate in triplicate.Pity.

BornAgain wrote:Thanks for that Caraman; it was very helpful.  It does beg the question of what AS would plate to. Perhaps the maximum axle load but that's inflexible if you are running lower and would probably depend on tyre type. My Broadway is plated 5 bar front 5.5 bar rear but at my maximum load (from a weigh bridge) I should be running at 3.25/5.25.  This is a massive difference at the front and the ride quality at the lower pressure is a big improvement. As it seems difficult to persuade a main dealer to modify I think I shall just live with the panel warning. At least the low pressure is flagged up when the ignition is switched on and it gives the actual pressures so you can see if there is a problem.

I am still puzzled that the local specialist (Citroen dealer but he had Peugeot software on his laptop) could read all the figures but was still unable to get the system to accept the change.  Of course, he wouldn't have needed a waiver from AS nor an 'elf & safety certificate in triplicate.Pity.

That's interesting.  I haven't tried driving after the TPMS has triggered so didn't know it then shows the actual pressure.  Does it do so for all tyres or just the ones that are below the TPMS setting?

Until recently I thought that the rear CP tyres could be run below 5.5 bar but they can't.  The advice given by Continental like all CP tyre manufacturers and the ETRTO (who make the tyre regulations) is that all rear CP tyres on a single axle/fitment should be run at 5.5 bar.  

Peugeot supplied the unconverted base vehicle to Auto-Sleepers with the tyre pressures set for when the unconverted vehicle is fully loaded.  This is confirmed in the Peugeot handbook and on the tyre pressure label/plate.  It doesn't state anywhere that the pressures are only for Camper (CP) tyres.  It should as the pressures are lower for light Commercial (C) tyres.  It also doesn't differentiate between brands.  The minimum pressures recommended by Continental and the ETRTO are different to Pirelli and Michelin.  I am told this is because different tyre manufacturers use different materials and their tyres' dimensions can be slightly different.  It also doesn't give a value to 'fully loaded' noting that 5.0 bar is 0.25 bar above the ETRTO’s maximum pressure for the front tyre’s maximum load of 1030 kg (or front axle mass of 2060 kg) and 0.85 bar above the ETRTO’s recommended pressure for the front axle’s MTPLM of 1850 kg.  All that is clear is that the figure of 5.0 bar for the front tyres is erroneous and irrelevant as far as our motorhomes are concerned.  


The NCC has stated that "all vehicles are plated with the tyre pressure for the maximum load that the vehicle can carry and it will be the drivers’ responsibility to vary this pressure if they wish to use the vehicle in an unloaded condition."  The DVSA has stated that "the tyre manufacturer is best placed to suggest what pressures are acceptable and these should not be exceeded unless on specific advice from them.".  Continental and the ETRTO recommend that if the front axle mass is 1425 kg or less as mine always is, the front tyre pressures should be 3.0 bar and not 5.0 bar!  I contend that the maximum my front axle mass can be is 1500 kg as progressive loading will result in the rear axle MTLPM of 2000 kg being reached first and the vehicle's overall MTLPM is only 3500 kg.  Continental and the ETRTO recommend 3.2 bar for a front axle mass of 1500 kg which is still a big improvement on 5.0 bar.  If the front tyre pressure is set to the front axle MTPLM of 1850 kg, which would be ridiculous, Continental and the ETRO recommend the front tyre pressures should be 4.15 bar.  I have suggested to Auto-Sleepers that if they re-plate my motorhome they should reduce the front axle MTPLM from 1850 kg to 1500 kg which won't change the vehicle's MTPLM of 3500 kg and therefore its loading margin.

The pressures are displayed when the ignition is switched on for any tyres that  are subject to a warning so at the moment I get a front warning of around 4.0 bar. I haven’t checked the front tyres myself but intend to reduce to around 3.5 bar before the next trip (next year possibly!).

Agree with your analysis and that it’s the front tyres that are an issue with plated pressures far in excess of anything you should need. Be interesting to see how you get on.

Caraman wrote:

bolero boy wrote:Why does the TPMS need to 'mandatorially working'...its just an 'extra' so is it no different to (say) a faulty satnav?
If I bought a £20 TPMS from eBay and it gave up the ghost I'd be under no obligation to get it fixed or removed, would I??

A satnav isn't a mandatory safety device but a TPMS is on new vehicles.  If you have an older vehicle without a TPMS and you then fit it with a TPMS, it doesn't have to work.

Am I right to assume that your PSA based Carthago has a TPMS that has been adjusted by the converter to allow the full range of front tyre pressures to be used as recommended by Continental?

No, my 2017 vehicle doesnt have one....good job as it happens.
...nor is it NCC approved....

Bolero Boy: can I please clarify you above posting?

Are you saying that your 2017 motorhome does not have TPMS (which I thought became mandatory from Nov 2014)

or

that you do have TPMS but it hasn't been adjusted by the converter to allow the full range of front tyre pressures to be used as recommended by, for example, Continental?

Cymro
PS: just seen Caraman's subsequent post, explaining. No need therefore to respond to mine, BB.

Thanks bolero boy.  That's something else I've learnt.  I have just read this on Out&aboutLive dtd Nov 18:

"Legislation was brought in on November 1, 2012, whereby all new cars (categorised as M1 vehicles) sold in the EU had to have a tyre pressure monitoring system (TPMS) fitted. This was subsequently extended to all passenger cars sold from November 2014. On January 1, 2015, TPMS was brought into the MoT test and an inoperative or faulty TPMS system now results in a MoT failure.
At present, light commercial vehicles, which form the majority of base vehicles for motorhomes, are not required to have TPMS installed. Campervans, which are based on passenger vehicles, including the Volkswagen Transporter, will have TPMS installed, but many motorhomes will only have TPMS installed if the purchaser specifies it, or the converter has opted to offer TPMS as standard."
I wonder when Peugeot started fitting TPMS to its Boxer?

IMO this is a very poor design decision by Peugeot. They seem to want to skimp by not providing any controls for the driver.

Other manufacturers such as VW permit the driver to set the TPMS pressures, and it's not a complicated user interface - it's literally one additional push button on the dash!

as above....its not a requirement to have TPMS on a MH..so i dont have it....
if i did (£20 from ebay would do me....) i would want to be able to set it to my own pressures.....which, despite ERTRO, i have at the 'previous' (IMO best) Continental recommendations.....which is nowhere near 80 psi.

Caraman wrote:

BornAgain wrote: .... but, of course, the tyre pressure warning light is now permanently on.  So, when it was in for MOT I asked whether the pressures could be reset. ....

A fully functioning TPMS is mandatory.  If the vehicle is run with the TPMS permanently triggered i.e. with the warning light on, it is not considered to be fully functioning as it will not detect any further reduction in tyre pressure and therefore should fail its MOT.

The MOT Testing Manual says, A TPMS warning light on due to underinflation is not a reason to fail a test.