filling van with water

We're seriously considering a 2014 Broadway EK TP LP and therefore new to the forum. Our other option is a Auto Trail Tracker. 

Having owned an Autocruise with the Whale system I'm not prepared to experience its foibles again. I've attempted to search the forums to find someone who has installed a standard water inlet system in a similar Broadway. Do members know of anyone and a possible link describing the process and cost? 

On balance we do prefer the Broadway. There are other issues though: the need to move the solar panel to accommodative a satellite dish and stowing the bedding under the bunks - no access locker door.

If you ask I believe A/S will fit a standard water fill for you in place of or in addition to the whale system.

The later Broadways have both systems fitted as standard but that may not be the case for a 2014 model.
I had the ordinary system fitted to a 2013 Nuevo which already had the whale system, just as other members here have done. It was done by Auto-sleepers at Willersey and the cost, I believe, was about £150.

If the Broadway EK TP LP doesn't have the roof light above the cab, the bedding can be stored in the overcab roof locker where it's far more conveniently located than under a side bench.

I added a locker door to one of our underbed storage spaces with no more than basic jigsaw skills required. I bought an offcut from the A/S Stores Dept for a tenner, plus some piano hinge and two catches. It wasn't a difficult job at all.

Moving the solar panel wouldn't be a problem. There's plenty of room up there.

Installing a "hole in the wall" water filler would also be pretty straightforward, and also a DIY job if you are handy. No need to drop the tank. The inlet spigot (from CAK Tanks) could go as high up the side wall as possible, and you would lose only a few litres of capacity. Not too expensive if done by A/S, as Merv has commented above.

Taken altogether, none of this would be a deal breaker to me.

Yes, thanks for all the useful comments. 

The Broadway doesn't have an overhead locker but I take on board the idea of an access door to the bunk bed. Something that I could do later (perhaps not with my skills says my OH) 
As to the water inlet - again. excellent,  armed with this information I hope the dealer can be persuaded to include the modification it in the price.

merv wrote:The later Broadways have both systems fitted as standard but that may not be the case for a 2014 model.

Saw your new posting while editing this one!

Yes there is a whale pump inside the freshwater tank, and although suits some people, others have had issues with it failing hence our decision to replace it with a better Shurflo pump.

When ordering our 2014 Broadway EB at the NEC Motorhome Show in 2013, we asked the dealer, as part of the purchase deal to arrange for AS to fit the "hole in the wall" as well as curtains round the cab. Glad we did! We never use the whale pump filler and pulling the curtains occasionally, when we are not using the silver screen covers, keeps the living space a little warmer (we found them useful on our previous AS Pollensa). 

Never thought, but at the same time we should have cheekily asked them to replace the rubbish freshwater whale pump sitting in the tank, with an efficient durable Shurflo pump! This job is now booked in at AS at our cost!!  - though well worth having done.

Just to say our new Shurflo pump will be fitted under the seat housing the Truma Heater and the leisure battery. AS will have to move the battery 90 degrees to place the pump on the deck near the piping. I think this is why it is costing us a little more. Your layout may be more accessible.
Pete

Pete

Can I take it that the water system (providing water to the taps and shower) uses an internal pump buried in the fresh water tank?

Cruise control please see previous posting, I have edited it!

Pete

https://www.autosleeper-ownersforum.com/t16292-whale-water-filler-not-filling

You may find the contents of the posts in the thread linked above of use.

Just to add to my bit about the fitting of the Shurflo pump by AS shortly, Mark in the Service Section said they will be removing the original whale pump in the freshwater tank as part of the process.

Pete

cruisecontrol wrote:Pete
Can I take it that the water system (providing water to the taps and shower) uses an internal pump buried in the fresh water tank?

Yes, and they seem to vary a lot in their efficacy.

Some members (us included) have found them a pain in the backside, while others have had no problems at all. No idea why, unless it has to do with the routing of the pipework, but I would suggest you don't plan to solve the problem unless you find you have it.

The main concern for us with an "iffy" pump, was how to replace it if it went wrong on holiday - needless to say on the first or second day!!! It cost more than I wanted to pay to have a Shurflo fitted, but as Pete said, well worth it for the peace of mind since we had a dodgy setup already.

Just a point about the Whale filler..We have got both and I do use the normal 'hole in the wall' for filling and journey with some tank water but a couple of weeks ago, we got set up on site and ..yes, maybe you've had this experience...I had forgotten to fill up at the site! levelling ramps set up, front seats swivelled, electric hooked up, cup of tea, etc!  you all know how great that first settled feeling is on site; so I thought, I will use the whale filler with the 10 litre water carrier. I have a very light trolley that I've had for years to transport the full water carrier and it was easier than moving the van to fill up or using the old faithful watering can. 
It also occurred to me, having read here all about the problems with possible failure of the tank's submersible pump,  that carrying a decent sized water container (which also has a little tap attached) would be a manage if the pump packed in whilst away.

I'm on my first outing in France to see how much I don't know about my 2014 Bourton.  First, without speaking a word of French, I neede an English to Franchise LPG adapter.  Got one now after much pointing!  Now my old problem of the water pump buzzing away.  The taps works fine and I can't see any evidence of a water leak, but rather irrertatingly the pump kicks in every couple on minutes almost like trying to get the system up to pressure.  I've followed the book to fill the water leaving taps open etc but this buzzing is driving me to distraction.  Obviously if I turn the power off to the taps it stops!  What am I doing wrong, or is this normal??

Its pretty certain you have a whale pump in the fresh water tank controlled by a pressure switch that is sensitive to voltage. I have no practical experience of them but I believe their is a procedure in the handbook for adjusting whether on hook up or not.

Many members of the forum have the system and experience of use......

Thanks.  The black square tank under the berth(drivers side) has an inspection hatch.  It's not full of water but should it be?  What is that tank?  I've tried adjusting the pressure switch with no joy!  Water was filled up from a container, not a hose this time.
Cheers

The fresh water tank in the Bourton is in two parts, the top part under the offside bench seat and the bottom part under the floor. The pump is in the bottom part.

The pump that supplies the taps and that is controlled by the pressure switch is totally independent of the filling system that can be either by hose or external pump.

Thanks Peter.  It's still buzzing away every two minutes!  Re The tank under the berth, should this be full of water?  (It's not at present) it has about 2" of water in it.

The tank you refer too is the top part of your total tank. If you want to be as full as possible it should be full but I think it just contains the top 25% of the total fresh water capacity - its contents are irrelevant to your pump operating issue.

Thanks Peter
The Whale pump stopped filling from my container, assuming it's full, but this tank has only 2" of water in it.  I've "played" with the "pressure switch" accessed via a cut out under the berth (drivers side) but still it buzzes!it "runs" for a few seconds each time.  It's putting me off my bottle of local red!  I'm on an Aire and plugged into the mains.  Can I assume the pressure switch is accessed from inside the van?

I also like the system.  Before plugging in to the van lift the lid as far as possible and then make sure that it engages in the grove when lowered.  Also I have just had to clean the contacts on the square block on the pump hose that plugs into the van. (contact cleaner and a rough cloth seems to do the job.)
If you stay on a site with a water point you will soon see its advantages.

Safari boy I'm not "plumbed in" at present just relying on the tank capacity for water, filling as required.  The gauges are not reliable?  Our waste always shows 100% full even when empty.  Thats another issue.  The problem(?) I have now is the buzz every two mins from the water pump.  It's irritating me no end!  The "fix" at present is to switch it off at the panel when we have finished with the taps, but this can't be right?

If the adjustingthe pressure switch has no effect it sounds as though you have a slight leak from the plumbing somewhere between the pressure switch and the taps.   Turn on the pump and time exactly how long between it stopping buzzing and the next buzz.  When it has finished buzzing then turn the pump switch off for about 10 minutes.  Then time how long from switching back on to when it starts buzzing.  If that is less than the time you measured previously then you have a leak - at least that is my thought.  If it is the same time then you may have a faulty pressure switch.
The A/S manual (see http://www.auto-sleepers.com/media/2014/12/Surrey-Northants-2009-handbook.pdf) gives good instructions on how to adjust your pressure switch.  However well you do so there will always be the odd short run of a second or two, particularly at night, when cooling in the pipes causes the pressure to fall thus triggering a short burst to regain pressure - but not every couple of minutes.

Thanks for your help Ron, but I can't open the link.  My handbook covers adjusting the pressure switch that I've attempted to do with no joy.  I can't see any evidence of a water leak.  I'll keep trying, otherwise I will have to take it to a dealer on my return to UK as trying to translate my issue to a French dealer is beyond my wife and I.  Merci!

Try the link now Starlight. (I don't know why it won't work in Ron's post, as the forum won't let me use HTML to check the syntax.)

http://www.auto-sleepers.com/media/2014/12/Bourton-2016-handbook.pdf (N.B. to avoid confusion, URL changed for the one Peter supplied in a later post. Apparently Ron's was for a different vehicle.)

It works for me now. If you still can't open it I'll have another look.

As for the irritating pump - we have the tee shirt!!! I think everything has been covered, but ours seemed far more stable while on hook-up. Once I had adjusted the pressure switch it was OK until we came off hook-up. Apparently the pressure switch and/or pump is very sensitive to voltage, and as the battery slowly runs down the pump starts playing up.

I don't know if this will help. As chronicled elsewhere on here, ours was such a pain in the rear (not just running at intervals like yours) that we got a Shurflo fitted. Absolute perfection ever since!!

Dave, I can't open Ron's link but yours opens OK so hopefully it will work for Starlight.