Many issues with new Broadway EL

To give some background information 

We collected our new  Broadway EL  from Marquis 2nd August 2023.  We  went away for 4 nights to try it out. From day one there were issues. On 9th August   we made an appointment and returned the van to Marquis on 22nd August and left it with them.  The following day we had a phone call from Marquis saying you can collect you van its done!  great news.  When we arrived the only thing that had been done was the oven door had been tightened.  On questioning this we were told a warranty claim had been submitted to Autosleeper and as soon as this had been passed the work to fix the faults would be carried out.  

7 weeks and two visits to Marquis and we were still waiting.  Promised update phone calls did not happen, every time we spoke to them we got a different story.  On one visit one of their service engineers told us to go direct to Autosleeper as it was the best way of getting a fix.  We were told Autosleeper have new policies in place for looking a Warranty claims and they are looked at once a week in a meeting, further questions may be asked of the dealer etc etc. The dealer said outright that if they waited long enough the problem may go away. Finally, I rang Autosleeper direct to be told our Warranty claim had been refused???  How can this possibly happen?  And why did no-one inform us?

Nonetheless the lady at auto sleeper  was  helpful and we booked an appointment to travel to them and leave the van to be fixes under Warranty. Most of the problems were rectified but some we just have to live with.  The clicking priming pump for example we were advised to upgrade it to stop it happening.  Not ideal when you have already spent £82k on the product.

We have been away twice recently in the colder weather, and have used the heating.  We are at all times plugged in to EHU but ..... the gas fires up (you can hear it) but cannot stop it.  You don't know it's switched to gas unless you hear the boiler kick in.  The result is we use a full tank of gas in four days, not realistic or affordable.  I have read that if the electric supply is unreliable the system detects this and switches to gas, but to test we plugged the van in at home and put the heating on 18 degrees setting EL2.  Over two days of 6 hour sessions a quarter tank of gas was used when it should have been none.  The hot water also heats up when it is turned off, I understand this happens when using the heating.

We went away in the winter in our Nuevo and never had this issue.

My question (before I go through the pain of going back to Marquis) is it safe to turn off the gas supply to the heating only using the red taps therefore the heating will use electric to work?  I know you should always go through the dealer, but it's stressful and upsetting to be messed around for weeks on end. I would rather avoid it if at all possible.

To give an idea of the issues I have listed them below.  All fixes were done by Autosleeper and not the dealer.



When on smart active  battery 
vehicle battery discharges causing alarm.  The battery is fine but alarm going multiple times every day causing the alarm system to notify us. Also wakes you up in the middle of the night.  Now fixed)

Kitchen area

drawer unit poor.  out of line and  excevive rattle when driving.  (adjustments made not as good as it could be but we live with it)

Cutelry drawer mis-aligned can be difficult to get in and out. (fixed)

Drop down flaps, loose and execive rattle when driving (fixed)

Oven door loose land rattles.  (its a good as its going to get, we put a tea towel in it when driving to stop the rattle)

Drop down shelf missing a spring. (fixed)

Remainder of van

Wardrobe door, storge cupboard beneath difficlut to close catches appear to need moving. (fixed)

Back window surround is not properly securesd, it's only held on by top rail. (fixed)

Offside window surround has come loose only secured by one side (fixed)

Rear window leaks. Water drips on to upholstery. (fixed window removed and refitted)

 Pump primes  regularly even when water not in use.  Noisy during the night click click click, no matter how you adjust it,  it does not fix it. (Advised pump upgrade will stop it)

Mirror in bathroom cabinet  catch in wrong place causes excess movement (Nothing can be done as cabinets are bought in not made by Autosleeper)

bathroom cabinet  over toilet upside down compared to Nuevo.  (We are told this is normal)

Small Table socket came out of floor when removing table,  all 8 screws detached. (We repaired this ourselves)

Burning smell electrical when water heater is on 60 degrees (Told this can happen with new vans, smell will dissipate in time)

It’s bad. My advice is to reject the van. It’s not too late.

Btw, if you’re a member of CAMC, you could contact their legal helpline for advice.

Duplicate deleted.

Did you order the van to be built to your requirements or was it a Marquis stock van that had been on display?

The vast majority of the faults you list are those that will not have been apparent at the factory but will have developed as the van has been driven - the coach built body flexes considerable as driven and when not pitched level.

I expect that in your van you have a Truma 6E and a separate Truma control panel that will allow settings: EL1, EL2, Mix1, Mix2 and Gas.  If you select EL2 and the units operates on Gas then there is a Truma fault and I suggest you contact them for advice.   If you've left the fridge switched to gas, that could be where the gas is going but not that fast.

Do you have an integrated Truma air conditioning unit?

The van was a stock item.  We drove around 100 miles each way on the original trip and pitched up on a hardstanding.  We have levelling blocks and a spirit level so we were all good there.

Yes we have the system you mentioned it is set to EL2.  We have checked and double checked.  When the boiler is running it still shows EL2.  The fridge is not set to gas and we developed a number of checks from when we started with the Nuevo to make sure all our settings are where they should be. In fact when we had the van plugged in at home to test,  everything other than the heating was turned off.

There is no integrated air con unit on this van, although we did have it on the previous Nuevo.  That only ran on EHU.

I will give Truma a call to seek advice as you suggested.  

It's such a pity that we have no confidence in the dealer and their ability to help, after all they are fast enough to take the money when you want to make a purchase.  

Thanks

Vans that have been on display have often had viewers who are not familiar with motorhome furniture and they cause this sort of minor damage.

The van should have a whale pump in the fresh water tank that is controlled by an accessible pressure switch, the instructions to adjust the pressure switch:



If the pump associated problem is not cured by correct adjustment, there is a none return valve in the pressure switch connection and a speck of dirt in there can cause water to drain back to the tank, reduce the pressure and activate the pump momentarily.  The valve is easily accessed and cleaned.  As far as I'm aware there is no upgrade for the whale pressure switch so the dealer is probably suggesting changing the pump to one of the diaphragm types such as Flojet or Sureflow that has an integral pressure switch.  Several owners prefer the diaphragm as there is no component hidden in the tank but, personally, I prefer the Whale system.  Whale are usually very helpful if you contact them for advice.

Another possibility for the problem with the water pump might be that there's a slight water leak. That will cause the pump to be activated. If possible, can you park the van somewhere level and dry, and leave the pump switched on. It may be possible to spot a leak - perhaps near the front of the rear offside wheel arch.

Cymro

Thank you for the suggestions re the pump.  Just to clarify it was not the dealer but the Autosleeper technician who suggested the change.  He said that he had checked for a leak and there was none.

We will investigate the dirt in the pump suggestion, and can contact Whale.  We think the Whale system is good and up to this point have not had any issues.  We really don't want to spend more money on a replacement system.

Just to clarify, the issue will be with the pressure switch and not the pump:

Link to pressure switch here

Davies500 wrote:The van was a stock item.  We drove around 100 miles each way on the original trip and pitched up on a hardstanding.  We have levelling blocks and a spirit level so we were all good there.

Yes we have the system you mentioned it is set to EL2.  We have checked and double checked.  When the boiler is running it still shows EL2.  The fridge is not set to gas and we developed a number of checks from when we started with the Nuevo to make sure all our settings are where they should be. In fact when we had the van plugged in at home to test,  everything other than the heating was turned off.

There is no integrated air con unit on this van, although we did have it on the previous Nuevo.  That only ran on EHU.

I will give Truma a call to seek advice as you suggested.  

It's such a pity that we have no confidence in the dealer and their ability to help, after all they are fast enough to take the money when you want to make a purchase.  

Thanks

Be wary of going directly to Truma as you will compromise your consumer rights. The seller is responsible for all and everything no matter what the manufacturer is. Going direct in effect leaves the seller able to tell you that you have not given them an opportunity to rectify and therefore no longer responsible.
Check your rights first and ensure you don’t do anything to negate them

My intent was to suggest to the OP that he go to Truma and Whale for advice, not remedy but maybe didn't make that clear.

I agree with Peter, I have called Truma a couple of times and they seem to be quite willing to give very helpful advice over the phone without "getting involved" in any repairs. See where you are coming from though Fixer, quite right of course.

My drop down table also had a spring missing and that broke afterbanshort time. And coat hooks fell off and the table post was fixed to floor with 1/2 inch screws that onlt screwed in to floor vinyl. All simple stuff but shows poor workmanship.
Worst was rear brakes seizing up, handbrake, near end of warranty, no help from AS, or Fiat, advised to deal with Fiat direct in Italy, ended up paying for repairs myself. I conclude warranty is worthless!

I have a recall from AS on the bike rack requiring a modification, chargeable at £80.00, return to dealer some 60 miles away!

We had most of the same faults, the cutlery draw runners etc, plus a pile of more serious ones 18 years ago. Went through all the same rigmarole: off to the dealer 4 or 5 times; back to the factory for 2 days to fix the things the dealer couldn’t; the denial of any problems with the construction and quality control by the same people.
We did hope that AS would change when a better organised and richer company took over.
Not to worry, if you keep the van long enough it will all seem normal. Apparently other UK converters are even worse.
It’s a shame because they basically produce a great product. One wonders about the day to day management though. Because it doesn’t seem to have improved at all.

I don't know why A-S don't fit them as standard as they are no more expensive and it makes the water system easier to repair.

For the same reason they don't put a £30 henderson hatch in the fresh water tank as we have done, you can change the pump, clean the sensors and air the tank out in a heartbeat. Never mind the quality feel the width.

For anyone thinking of buying a new motorhome in my opinion it's a good idea to go to a big motorhome show such as the NEC, on the last day. You can poke around all the models you fancy and see if the cupboard doors are coming unhinged, if drawers still close properly, if handles and hooks are coming adrift. The show models will have had five years of wear inside. You won't know if there are water leaks or electrical faults of course but it does serve as a good indication of build quality.
As for A/S and water leaks I have had a few different models and they all suffer where A/S don't bother to fit things properly. I have had water drains running uphill, and the connectors are not glued as they should be but joints which should be glued are just pushed together so they drip. My current A/S, a Bourton had such appalling quality flexi pipes going to the washroom basin tap that they leaked profusely before I fitted some proper ones.
You will hear a lot of negative comments about Marquis after sales. I would got there to look at models but never to buy one. Though I do accept that one Marquis dealer might be better than another and I have heard one good report of one dealer.

Sad to hear about the problems you are experiencing.  Whether the MH is built to order or from display, the dealer should have sufficient experience to do a full pre delivery inspection.  I purchased our Broadway from Marquis eight years ago and the PDI had obviously not been at all thorough resulting in it being taken back eleven times before most issues were resolved.  This added hundreds of miles of unnecessary use.  My Broadway is now working well but it will never go anywhere near the original dealer again.  Hope you get your problems sorted.  
PS Purchased in Hampshire so can’t comment on our local M dealers.

In my opinion, the Devon (Lee Mill) branch is equally as appalling as the one you purchased from, Scribes. In fact I’d not touch any of their dealerships with a bargepole.

Tinwheeler wrote:In my opinion, the Devon (Lee Mill) branch is equally as appalling as the one you purchased from, Scribes. In fact I’d not touch any of their dealerships with a bargepole.

Sad to hear that.  I’d heard that before they were taken over by Marquis a few years ago, they were very good.
My experience with Alan Kerr in Paignton, not an AS dealer, has been much the same.  Sadly a lot of these companies are happy to take your money but not give good customer service.

I would like to promote an excellent dealer and that is Lowe and Rhodes in Stoke on Trent. I bought my Bourton, 3 years old at the time from them. In France last October the air temperature went down to 10 degrees and I was shivering driving it so I pulled into a commercial Mercedes dealer at 6:30pm who fixed it the next day. Lowe and Rhodes paid the £570 bill promptly without complaining at all.

They are a main dealer for Swift caravans and motorhomes. From what the salesman told me of the condition they arrive to the dealership from the factory. I wouldn't even cast a glance at a Swift. Even things like doors missing, not just with loose hinges.

After my experience of a Rapido which had an appallingly bad electrical fault where a plug was not pushed into its socket properly, I won't look at another Rapido. The assembly person HAD to know it wasn't connected because one pin was sticking out. You can't push together an 8 pin plug and socket without looking at what you are doing, even if you are a Frenchman smoking a Galloise and drinking a glass of wine at the same time.

ScribesWtr wrote:
Sad to hear that.  I’d heard that before they were taken over by Marquis a few years ago, they were very good.
My experience with Alan Kerr in Paignton, not an AS dealer, has been much the same.  Sadly a lot of these companies are happy to take your money but not give good customer service.

You seem to be talking about Marquis Exeter but my experience is of the Lee Mill branch near Plymouth. I’ve posted here several times about them.

Martins at Exeter were pretty good. I wouldn’t like to say what’s happened since Marquis took over but I can guess.

Alan Kerr has had a lousy reputation for as long as I can remember.

Yes, I was referring to the Exeter dealer.  I took the Broadway to Lee Mills for a service when we first moved to Devon and wasn’t that impressed it’s them either..

Very much the case their is good and bad in all of them. Unlike Tinwheeler my experience of Marquis Plymouth was excellent but that was a few years ago. Has no call to use them and probably wouldn't now but would find a good independent for repairs.
Happy to report since clearing the initial issues and there were plenty the van has been 100%.
Seems all these vans are the same these days and faults are inevitable no matter what make.