Butane V LPG

Not sure what the situation is where you are but here in North Lancashire it appears there is a shortage of Butane so it's proving vey difficult at present to obtain refills for the Calor 4.5kg blue canisters. Calor themselves said it's been an issue for several months and suggest I switch to propane and purcahse a new regulator as they don't see the situation improving any time soon. Good advice do you think?

Thanks
Duncan

Duplicate post, reply on other post .

If you find a source of PROPANE in 6Kg bottles, please let me know, there are, effectively none in E Anglia
I have now resorted to this solution.
It has many advantages but is comparatively expensive.
For UK it's 2 x 6Kg propane assuming I can ever get my empty 2nd bottle filled/exchanged
For Europe it's as in the pic. Campingaz is available all over Europe, so after 1 x 2.75kg bottle is empty we still have one left. You could buy a refillable system, but there are some issues there too. You could buy a French bottle and regulator but you can't get it exchanged anywhere but France. Ditto Spain/Holland/Germany.............
Just done a 3 week trip rarely on EHU and the campingaz bottle lasted just over 2 weeks. Got a new one (30Euro) at Hoorn Marina where we were night stopping, no probs.

Butane, BTW is no use at all in winter it freezes, you think you've run out but the bottle isn't empty, just that the gas won't come out.

In my case then it'll be 2 x 6Kg propane if I can ever find any!!

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IanH wrote:If you find a source of PROPANE in 6Kg bottles, please let me know, there are, effectively none in E Anglia
I have now resorted to this solution.
It has many advantages but is comparatively expensive.
For UK it's 2 x 6Kg propane assuming I can ever get my empty 2nd bottle filled/exchanged
For Europe it's as in the pic. Campingaz is available all over Europe, so after 1 x 2.75kg bottle is empty we still have one left. You could buy a refillable system, but there are some issues there too. You could buy a French bottle and regulator but you can't get it exchanged anywhere but France. Ditto Spain/Holland/Germany.............
Just done a 3 week trip rarely on EHU and the campingaz bottle lasted just over 2 weeks. Got a new one (30Euro) at Hoorn Marina where we were night stopping, no probs.

Butane, BTW is no use at all in winter it freezes, you think you've run out but the bottle isn't empty, just that the gas won't come out.

In my case then it'll be 2 x 6Kg propane if I can ever find any!!

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Many thanks Ian.

And if I swap to Propane, which seems to be available in 4.5kg canisters here, apart from changing the regulator will I need to change anything on the fridge and cooker?

Sorry for my ingnorance on this, my previous van had an on board built under gas canister which just got refilled externally with LPG.

Duncan

No. Regulator does all you need

This is my vague understanding on this topic.
I believe propane regulators that screw to a cylinder deliver gas from the regulator at 37mbar, however I see on eBay that the clip on the cylinder type regulators are rated at 27mbar.

Around 2002/3 there was a change that introduced an end to the fitting of regulators on the cylinder, and the installation by the motorhome manufacturer of a bulkhead regulator at 30mbar. Appliances that used gas were therefore installed expecting gas at 30mbar, be it butane or propane. In our 2003 Duetto I fitted a bulkhead 30mbar regulator and used an adapter at the cylinder if I changed over from butane to propane. This also enabled me to use Campingaz, treating it like a butane cylinder.

When we visited France etc. I'd change over to Campingaz, which incidentally has a mixture of butane and propane.

The bottom line is, can your appliances take propane coming out at 37mbar? I suspect this is not ideal, and not a pressure they would be expecting.

My vague advice, use a clip on propane regulator (27mbar) with the suitable propane cylinder, they may be uncommon, I don't know.
Long term I suggest you get fitted a 30mbar bulkhead regulator that can take propane, butane and Campingaz. This needs to be fitted high up in the gas locker and a good quality hose to link the gas cylinder to the regulator, important this.

All that said I had a right bother sorting out a Cadac 2+2 BBQ and what gas pressure it would take. I use it with our Kemerton XL BBQ oulet that I believe is at 30mbar. Cadac want a universal BBQ, not to produce different models for butane or propane. I think the manufacturers apply a fudge factor (blind eye) to some of these regulations.

Cooking on gas, my impression is that propane is hotter.

Thanks for your advice, much appreciated.

An addition to my previous post. I referred to having a good quality hose if you have a fixed bulkhead regulator, this hose will have to withstand gas pressures at the cylinder's pressure This is unlike the older arrangement when the gas regulator was attached to the cylinder, here the hose would only be exposed to the reduced pressure the regulator was delivering, somewhere between 27mbar and 37mbar.

When bulkhead regulators were introduced there were instances where chemicals in the hose would leech out under the high pressure and run back and clog the regulator. This is the reason to have the bulkhead regulator higher than the cylinder, so any liquid runs back inside the hose and into the cylinder where it wont clog the regulator. I think it is one of those occasions when buying cheap high pressure hose on eBay or even Amazon isn't wise.

Thank you for your replies, there is certainly a great deal of knowledge and advice on here, for which I am very grateful. I've spoken to Calor direct this morning about supplies of Butane and Propane in 4.5kg and 3.9kg canisters. To say they were unhelpful is an understatement. Unhelpful, uninterested, unsympathetic and unbelievably curt to say the least.

I have been offered to swap my 4.5kg Butane canisters free of charge for Flogas canisters this morning by a local dealer, who don't seem to have an issue with supply of Flogas. 

Has anyone had any experience with Flogas and if so is it a suitable alternative to Calor? Obviously I'd need a suitable regulator, but would my appliances need to be reconfigured in any way?

Thanks again for the help.

LPG is LPG. We have Flogas at home for domestic use.

Flogas easily available here. (E Anglia)