Stanton Truma heater access

Can't see how it is possible to get to the Truma heater for service. In the past, on other outfits, I have had need to reset the thermal cutout button beneath the circuit board cover after the 12V cut out while the heater was operating. (more than once, more than one system).

It looks like the whole wardrobe front needs to be removed to get to the main heater/furnace. Surely I'm wrong (again!).

Any advice/experience?

We are currently unable to get at the 240 V fuse to replace it so that we can use the water and space heater ( Truma Combi 6) on electricity. The drawer above the wardrobe front comes out reasonably easily and we can check that the thermal cut out is as it should be but, despite help online via members of this forum, we can’ t get at the actual fuse to change it.

We had a service technician in to try but he, after thoroughly examining the problem, refused to have anything to do with it. 

Why do AS fit the heater in the most difficult position possible or not provide an external access point ? 

Good luck with yours and I hope you can avoid removing the wardrobe front. A third hand, mirror and something to prod with help when resetting the cut out. A tablet stylus is useful for prodding.

It would surely be feasible to make the front area below the drawer into a door to access the heater. I can see how the older models used this space for the front hung heater.
How hard can it be? If I could get hold of the material (lightweight wood effect panel) I would be tempted to convert it myself. without a door, how good will the habitation check be?
Perhaps a door can be inset, so may not need more material (other than edging strip to finish the cut edges).
Trouble is the Stanton is only 2 months old. I may get executed for approaching it with my Jig Saw!

Unless your heater orientation is different to ours, then even having a bigger front access is not a great deal of help because all the works are at the back of the heater - ie between the van external wall and the heater itself.

Our heater has been completely removed twice now  ( once for new element, once for complete new heater,)  but never once replaced with the works facing the internal wood panel which is the obvious way to fit it.

PLOUGHLIN wrote:These are the installation instructions. https://www.truma.com/web/downloadcenter/files/truma-heating-combi-e-installation-de-en-fr-it-nl-dk-se.pdf Perhaps AS have little option how installed?

You might well be right. Ours has been back to Truma for a new element and the engineer made no comment. For him to remove it is not a problem however but for those of us without a workshop or in foreign parts, it is a problem even doing something as basic as a resetting a thermal cutout or replacing a 240V fuse.  

Swings and roundabouts; we had a Bessacarr once in which the Combi 4 took up a whole single bed locker to itself. No problems servicing etc but a dreadful waste of precious storage space.

AS are not alone. My neighbour has a Dethleffs and even with access through his rear storage garage he can't get at that lower mains fuse so just used gas. My sister has a Swift caravan and has had the fuse replaced twice under warranty but now out of warranty, can't access this fuse and just sticks to gas. Personally I think the problem is with the heater. It wouldn't need access if the fuse didn't blow.

I have just taken a (very) close look at the front panel of the wardrobe.
It is split at the drawer aperture such that the complete lower part can be removed for access by removing the eight screws hidden behind the brown plastic caps. The caps prise off and can be re-fitted easily - watch your fingernails.

The installation instructions are interesting. The clearances between the ends where the air intake and fan are can be as little as 10mm and AS seem to have stuck very close to this.

I think access will be better (possible) by removing the bottom panel. That must be the trick. A mirror would be a must, as will disconnecting any electrical supplies.

Looking inside from the drawer aperture, there would be room for an external service hatch, but I can see how it would cost more and be very tempting to use it for extra storage.

The reason for the enquiry today is that I occasionally get an alarm telling me that the heater outlets are obscured. this is associated with a silent fan and a very hot smell. Only by temporarily running the fan on maximum with all the vents wide open will the alarm clear and the heater will then run on Eco fan ok. I wonder if the fan sometimes does not start up when needed on Eco?

Could be time to talk to my dealer.

On two of my vans although a reset is mentioned there was none
Gef

Hi guys, We had problems with the 10amp fuse at the bottom of the electronics panel on a number of occasions. This happened particularly when we were on the continent, and it's in a devil of a position to try to get at.

Whilst visiting Mark at A/S Willersey we had a Sollatek Electronics AVS30 unit fitted to give protection against: High voltage, Low voltage, Spikes/surges, Powerbacks/surges. Mark's opinion was that electrical power supplies abroad are notorious for bad problems such as our vehicle had suffered. The AVS30 was fitted between the power socket on the side of our 'van and the EC500 (cut the wire, splice the AVS30 in, fix it in place on the inside of the cupboard).

Happily enough, we have had no problems ever since the AVS30 was fitted - no more fuse blowing etc at all.

Now, I don't guarantee this will sort your problems Dare-Devil-Dennis but it was worthwhile for us and other people who have the same device. Also, of course, you need to have a replacement slow-blow 10amp fuse fitted - available from Maplins etc.

Regards, Barry and chihuahua ensemble.

What a great observation and simple(ish) solution. Thanks, I will look into this.

Being pro-active is better than chasing faults I'm sure you'd agree. I worked for years in the field of industrial instrumentation in the water industry. Lightning protection involved similar suppression boxes for which it was never possible to prove they actually work unless you fit lots and study the failure rates of instrumentation following weather events. They do work.

For an individual installation there is never enough statistical data to prove suppression and mains stabilisation works, so it can feel like the Emperor's New Clothes. I believe, for this however it is a very sensible prcaution to take. 

Many thanks for the heads-up

stoneb wrote:Happily enough, we have had no problems ever since the AVS30 was fitted - no more fuse blowing etc at all.

Regards, Barry and chihuahua ensemble.

Thanks Barry, and small hairy mutt. 

That's useful information, although both times ours has blown it was in the UK.

Did you get the AVS30 gadget fitted under warranty - and if not would you mind saying what it cost please.

Dave and Welsh Terrier ensemble. 

Hi Dave (I once had a friend named Dave-the-Dog, even his postman in Totnes, Devon, used to deliver letters thus addressed)

Yes, I bought the AVS30 via Amazon for about £60, and Mark at A/S fitted it (again, about £60) in order not to nullify their habitation warranty.

In use, on hook-up at home, the unit refused to allow voltage to flow into the 'van at one time. On checking with a multimeter I discovered our house was being fed with 260 volts. AVS30 can be ajusted to your own requirements to cut out above and below voltages you set (I set it between 260v and 200v) Also waiting time limits can be set when checking is done again by the unit to retest voltage supply etc.

Regards, Barry and FOUR long-coat chihuahuas (hence "ensemble") (weights from 1.5Kg to 2.5Kg for vehicle loading info!!)

Many thanks from us too Barry.

We had the electric side of the heating ( fuse ?) go and the microwave stop microwaving ( though lights, timer and revolving plate all worked) in the space of a few days and we suspected a voltage surge though the other user of the bollard had no problems. Could have been coincidence but we will investigate your gizmo via AS.

This is one of those "clutching at straws" problems isn't it! As Dennis said earlier, it's often impossible to know if the solution has worked or whether the problem never occurred again. (Take the medicine three days before the symptoms appear!!  )

Our very good mechanical chappie at the dealer has changed a few fuses, but only ever when the boiler was shoe horned into the smallest possible space - as in the Nuevo, Broadway and other similar installations.

There's no doubting that it gets very hot in there, and he thinks it may be to do with the excessive heat. (I'm skeptical, but his experience does suggest a possible link.)

I quizzed a Truma engineer and he was non-committal. Well, he would be as Truma would have "signed off" the installation procedure on the vans before their boilers were allowed to be fitted, so he would never admit it even if that is a contributary cause. 

I've installed a pair of computer fans in the top of the panel, just below the drawer, one sucking in and one blowing out, to ventilate the space far more effectively. I don't know if it has prevented the fuse blowing again, but the drawer above the boiler is no longer any use as a slow cooker!!!! 

If anyone is interested in more detail I'll take a couple of photos and describe the fitting.

This is another great idea, What a useful resource this site is!

An extra fan will harvest the heat in the heater space and put it into the main area where it will do more good. A small extra overhead on the leisure battery if off EHU. You could connect it through a room thermostat inside the heater space and an external switch to turn off your new feature.

Gromit, Did it need both fans? or did you find an extractor did not do enough? My Stanton has a large Grille in the front panel but as it is a passive vent, not very effective as the drawer does get too toasty.

Dare-devil-dennis wrote:An extra fan will harvest the heat in the heater space and put it into the main area where it will do more good. A small extra overhead on the leisure battery if off EHU. You could connect it through a room thermostat inside the heater space and an external switch to turn off your new feature.

Gromit, Did it need both fans? or did you find an extractor did not do enough? My Stanton has a large Grille in the front panel but as it is a passive vent, not very effective as the drawer does get too toasty.

Hi Dennis

Yes - it pulls the heat out into the hab area quite well. The air from the output fan is significantly warm to the hand.

I did consider a thermostat, but didn't bother in the end. Whenever the boiler is in use (using main electricity) the fans will also be necessary, so I just installed an illuminated switch alongside the boiler control panel. I took the power feed from the internal light in the wardrobe so it was easy enough to conceal the wires and route them to the switch and fans. As you say, the current drain is minimal, and I wouldn't need to use them when off EHU as the electrical side of the boiler would not be in operation. 

I think it did need both fans. At first I installed the two with both sucking out from the enclosure. The one on the left which is above the hot air tubes blew out warm air, while the air from the other was little different to the ambient temperature. So I turned the right hand one around so it blew air into the enclosure, and it made it much more effective - judging by the considerably reduced heat inside the drawer and on the side of the wardrobe.

I'm quite happy with the appearance, as there were three vents in the panel already, and two more behind circular louvres look as if they were installed at the factory. The hole for the illuminated switch is small enough to fill and conceal (if ever necessary) behind one of those circular sticky covers that are already extensively used in the van.

The only further mod I'm planning is to fit a DC/DC variable transformer to reduce the speed of the fans a bit. The fans on their own are quiet enough, but the air blowing through the louvres makes a bit of a noise. Not too obtrusive, but it would be better if they were quieter, and there's more than enough air flow so some reduction will make little difference to their efficacy.

Hope this makes sense.

Hi
Earlier post in this thread describes the fitting of an AVS30 under/over voltage protector.

I found this on flea bay...

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/35mm-40A-220V-50-60HZ-Over-and-Under-Voltage-Protective-Device-Relays-2P/401432865461?_trkparms=aid%3D555018%26algo%3DPL.SIM%26ao%3D2%26asc%3D49131%26meid%3D0da8ff381ae942dbaf8c45041bea7f35%26pid%3D100005%26rk%3D1%26rkt%3D3%26sd%3D183015577374&_trksid=p2047675.c100005.m1851

I would appreciate any advice from members who might be able to compare this with the £60 ish AVS 30 device. Looks to me like it will do the same (or similar protection job at a much more affordable price.

Any views?

No idea Dennis - I'm thick when it comes to electronics!

Worth a punt though if it will be suitable (Peter#1 will know). Whether it will solve the underlying problem however is open to speculation, which is why I wouldn't want to spend £60+  . . . . more in hope than expectation.

£7.50 is well worth it - even if it doesn't solve the fuse problem. A handy additional protection anyway. I await Peter's assessment with interest.

My experience of our Chinese friends is that if it works it works well and if it doesn't they will replace it till it does.  They charge what they think is a good price, often a 10th of what it would cost if process through a European distributor.

With the model Dennis linked too it is critical that the earth connection between the EHU and the Van installation is not lost during the process of installation.

What do I think; I've never had a problem in the van with over or under voltage so for me it is an unnecessary installation and an additional potential point of failure.  I would not install either of the units mentioned in this thread.

Thanks Peter.

It certainly makes good sense to wait for a variable voltage problem to occur before trying to solve it!

I'm not convinced that the blowing fuse problem falls into that category, since our two failures occurred in the UK on (presumably) stable EHU supplies. I just wondered if installing the voltage protector would eliminate that possibility?

It would be good if someone could come up with a definitive answer to what causes the fuses to blow for no apparent reason. As I said before, the Truma help desk is about as much use as a fag on a motorbike!

My fuse repair on the Truma was put down to  "connector issue" where the tech thought the mains connector to the Truma might have been loose. 

I have my uneasy doubts about this sort of diagnosis. It says to me "I don't really know" and it is just as likely to be caused by supply surges. Personally, I would not be too confident on all sites that the site installation and cabling (and where it runs), and the other stuff connected to it will always give as good as you get at home. My blown fuse did not happen again in the next few months while I owned the motorhome but it did cost me a 100 mile round trip to the dealer.

I think I will put one of these in a weatherproof box and a 16A plug and socket to go in-line with the EHU cable. No Mods to MOHO and same level of protection.

I have an AVS30 installed as it was transferred across from my previous m/h.  Over one year of use (both m/h) it has activated once on sensing a low voltage.

That's interesting MikeJJ. Was it on a UK or EU site?

I've not had a chance to look at the product in detail, but I doubt if it (the Chinese one) is worth having. The voltage range appears to be fixed with 160 and 275 volt limits - but certainly in the UK I doubt that there is any realistic possibility that you will ever see a sustained mains voltage anywhere near as high as 275V. Perhaps it's possible in other parts of Europe and elsewhere in the world, but I doubt it.

Of course you may well see transient peaks much higher than that, but that device is definitely not what I would call a surge protector. It's slow to react, because its spec is <1s for it to cut off. If your appliances have had more than 275V for almost 1 second they will probably already have had it!

And then there is the 1 minute that you have to wait before it will connect the incoming mains. You will have to wait this long every time you hook up. Ok, you may not be in a hurry as you're on holiday, but that would annoy me!