Looking at a Trooper tomorrow

Hi All,

We sold a 2012 California 180 4motion in January - a great camper in many ways and we had some brilliant trips (me, the wife and two young kids) but the darn thing ended up being a reliability disaster despite buying it new. 
Anyway we've looked at the lower powered 140 models (more reliable), a new T6 but the thought of spending so much again on that engine just isn't a happy one.
So we've spotted a 2.5 130 Trooper about two hours drive away - 2005, 65k(ish) miles. Anything to look out for? We have a (tall) 7 year old and a nearly 5 year old - would they be okay sleeping "upstairs" - it looks smaller than the Cali up there.
Is the seat/bed fixed (it was a sliding seat on the Cali)? Anything we should look for? Leaky roof? Anything else?!

Many many thanks!!

TBH I have never actually tried the roof bed in a Cali - but it's fair to assume that the Trooper's roof bed is going to be a ~lot~ smaller.

No, the seat/bed does not slide itself, although the front section slides forward (i.e. it's not a conventional rock&roll, in that you sleep on the face of the seat back, rather than the back of the seat back).

From the experience of a recent Trooper purchase, I would have an HPI check, I would have the diagnostic codes checked (we did not and this one looks to have at least one hidden fault which will be expensive to fix) and ask whether all the appliances are tested working, because if you get the traditional "it worked last time we used it" you may find it doesn't now - and for example if that happens with the diesel heater, that could be costly too.

I'd definitely get it HPI checked; any way I can get diagnostics done? It's had a recent main dealer service.

The Trooper was marketed as a 2 berth - though mine came with the optional bed bases and ladder, so there was scope for another bed - Autosleepers made the high top Trident as the 4 berth version...basically the same van but with much more space upstairs (and that lovely big skylight). IMHO you would struggle with two growing children above. Long term you would be better off in a Trident, though not so "cool".
If it's had a recent service (and cambelt ?) then it's probably just mechanical, unlikely to have had all the major services checked, gas, electric, etc, usually done as part of a habitation service.
As mentioned, the back seat is fixed - but it is set back further than most conversions so still a good floor area.
The roof is far better for all year round use than the fabric popup, though it's quite an old fashioned design (i.e crude) and all the ones I've had - and I've had quite a few out of 19 campers - suffer from poor sealing where the sides join the roof, a bit of diy is usual. 
In some ways you might find it a bit strange going from a modern hi-tec camper back to a more traditional model (though for us the Troopers toilet is worth more than a lot of gadgets) but I'm sure you wouldn't have got this far without weighing up the pros and cons.

Thanks; some useful pointers. 
Our kids are still quite young (7 and 4) so might be small enough; I will take a tape measure!

TBH while it was nice having an electric raising roof, climate, satnav, a central control unit, etc it wasn't nice having to have (we bought this new and sold it with under 23k likes)

1) A new steering column
2) Severe roof paint corrosion twice 
3) Paint wrecked by a main dealer "cleaning" it.
4) New rear diff
5) 3 EGR valves
6) New ECU
7) Failed control unit
8) A roof that without a big cover, was as watertight as a piece of loo roll. 
9) Numerous other niggles.

The emissions issue alone took nine weeks to sort....

...taking your children would be more beneficial than a tape measure - the tape measure won't grow or wriggle about.....
You didn't say, but before you drive a long way make sure that it does come with the upper bed sections, ladder and front net - it was an option on the Trooper, and most don't have them, as the logical way to accommodate 4 for sleeping would be to choose a Trident instead.

repoort wrote:...taking your children would be more beneficial than a tape measure - the tape measure won't grow or wriggle about.....
You didn't say, but before you drive a long way make sure that it does come with the upper bed sections, ladder and front net - it was an option on the Trooper, and most don't have them, as the logical way to accommodate 4 for sleeping would be to choose a Trident instead.

I think their teachers might not approve! I reckon we can get a good idea. It also comes with a decent drive away awning.
I'll check on the bed bits but I'm fairly sure he mentioned them.

You don't sound too keen - are you not pleased with yours?

I really don't like high tops - they don't mix with cross winds too well and it's too much weight too high - my folks had a couple and wouldn't have another.

...yes, I'm very pleased with mine, it's the best camper I've had (not the newest, had a '60 reg T5.1 Hillside Leisure previously) - was just trying to see it from your point of view with twice as many people living in it. A driveaway awning will certainly make a big difference.

As with Repoort - we have had other A/S pop-tops before (though not as many as him!) and there is a lot to be said for them but... the roof is not that big (because none of the useable space is above the cab when up) and the poor sealing around the joins will annoy you if you go anywhere where there are large numbers of midges - because it is very difficult to stop them getting inside!

In between the pop-tops I've owned a couple of high tops (on a Transit and a Trafic) and TBH I didn't really notice the additional weight high up - there is no doubt a small difference but it's not that great, because the pop-top is lower but more complex. I kept the Transit based high top A/S for ten years and really liked the space and storage - the only thing I really didn't like about it was washing it (and the rust, but then it was a Transit)...

I had a high top a Topaz, never had problems with it, lovely to be able to stand up without raising the roof, high winds, you drive accordingly, same as I do in my coach built now, I didn`t have a rust problem.

Until you have been in one and imagined living in it, tried everything for size and how will it be in bad weather? if there are four of you in a small space. lots to think  about, Good luck

We coped (just) in a Force 10 in the California! We'll see.
Anyway, it's completely clear on HPi so that's a good start.

Had two Californias  over 5 years, before deciding we wanted a few more home comforts and buying our Symbol.
The first was with the 2.5 174bhp engine which whilst not as free revving as the 2.0 180bhp in our second California always felt more robust. As the Americans say "you can't beat cubes".
To be fair had no problems with either engines but had the roof corrosion problem on the second van. This problem was known about when we got our first in 2009 and didn't expect it to be unresolved for such a long time.
A friend runs an airport taxi/transfer business and he misses the 2.5 engine which needed little maintenance (no cambelts) and was reliable for 100s of thousand miles, essential for the business.

Hubert

Well that was rather odd - got there after a 2 hour drive;  it was a bit shabby but okay. Had a good nose around - the "solid" roof was definitely a bit odd. Had a drive - definitely prefer the 2.5 to the newer 2.0 - pulls better from low revs, sounds better.
It needed a fair few jobs doing - new brake disks and pads all around, O/S drive shaft was an advisory but the interior was on pretty good nick. The exterior was a bit tattier but not bad.
So we made a fairly keen offer (for cash), the seller got rather irate and almost threw us out of the house (I've just had a rather apologetic text message!).

Had lunch, popped into Carrs Exeter, had a nose around the new T6 vans, got a quote, ordered a T6 150 4motion California for delivery in March. Oops... 

A bit of a shame in some ways as you all seem like a really nice bunch here; sadly a fair few Cali owners are a little up themselves. Oh well!

It depends how much the seller was asking and how much you offered, but the thing is that recent Troopers are comparatively rare, because they were immensely expensive compared to pretty much anything else equivalent (e.g. significantly more than a Cali in their final incarnation) during the last 8-10 years, so A/S sold relatively few. Reading between the lines, I'm pretty sure that A/S were trying to kill it off because they wanted to move their brand towards high-end coachbuilts, but they were still getting buyers when the "entry level, no options" price for a Trooper was £54k.

In fact when I was looking to buy one 3 years ago, I looked at a 2 year old 30k mile Trooper Low-lie and the dealer (Marquis) wanted £54k for it!

So unless the seller was asking silly high money to start with, he would have been pretty daft to accept a low offer. As long as he's not asking way over the odds he shouldn't have too much trouble shifting it. Despite the slightly old-fashioned look, you only have to look at dealer prices for Troopers to realise that you would have to be very lucky to get one cheap.

This may change a bit now that A/S seem to have started selling the Trooper again as "standard product" but that will depend on how many they sell and how well-made the dealer conversions turn out to be. It's not clear how the Trooper is currently being marketed, nor how it fits into their product range - it seems to be available as a brand new conversion, but I could find no reference to it on their website...

Anyway, it's academic now as far as you are concerned!

IIt was a 2005 130bhp on 63k miles. On for £25k,needed at least £1k spending on mechanical bits. And while the living area was in great condition, the cab area and exterior were pretty worn. It also had a tape player!!!

There's a 54 plate 1.9 with 59k miles on via Bilbo for under £25k; the would have a warranty. And a 66k mile 53 plate T4 Trooper on for £19950;again with a warranty.

So I think it was a fair offer.

But we'll now be spending double that but getting £4K off RRP; way cheaper than a new AS conversion. 

However I'm not dismissing AS; I think they do some great conversion (apart from the graphics). 

Ours will be dark metallic blue and should look a bit like this

...I've always believed that AS van conversions have always been rather "old fashioned" when compared with other makes....and therefore appealed to the older, more mature owner who is far more likely to take pride in the vehicle and look after it carefully - in all my van buying and selling days I never came across a tatty or neglected one.
Mine is a '07, 1.9TDI, purchased privately March '14, 1 owner, FSH, 23k miles, Cruise Control, Awning, etc....I paid £27k, and whilst it was the price of a new Mercedes, it was exactly what I wanted...took a long time to find it, as said, there's not many about...and I was determined to get the colour I wanted, Wheat Beige.
 I've not regretted buying it for one minute, I've had enough vans to know what is needed for comfortable living, rather than lots of gadgets.

Sounds like a nice, very low mileage example; not surprised you like it!

When we sold our California, apart from a fairly chipped bonnet (annoyingly so; I reckon it was soft paint), the dealer who bought it couldn't believe what great condition it was in; I regularly clayed and polished it, sealed all carpets, etc. I have a garage full of "detailing" products so our vehicles do always look tidy. 

Not too worried about gimmicks so apart from 4motion, it only has a few extras. Our old 180 was loaded with options and they just aren't worth it.