winterization

Hello anyone who can help!  I didn't have a handbook with the Duetto but photocopied pages from our friend's which was for an Autosleeper Talbot.  Very helpful but sometimes different from ours.  Their last paragraph reads as follows:

6. Turn off the stop tap fitted to the cold water (blue) inlet pipe.  This tap is fitted below the offside dinette seat backrest cushion and is immediately ahead of the rear corner of the cocktail cabinet.  Access is achieved by removing a small trim panel.

None of this is applicable to a Ford Duetto, no cocktail cabinet for a start.  So, is there a cold water inlet pipe or a tap?

Looking forward to some advice.  Wendy

What make/model of water heater does your Duetto have installed?

It's quite possible or even likely that a Talbot-based van would have had a much older style of water heater fitted - possibly a Vaillant. I suspect that a '94 Duetto would have a Carver Cascade fitted, and drain-down for those is completely different - but not much point describing that without knowing what is actually fitted to yours...

The 1994 Duetto was fitted with a Carver water heater and to drain it down for the winter:

1) Open the drain taps on both the fresh and waste tanks (don't forget the toilet tanks as well).

2) Open all the taps (kitchen, washbasin and shower)

3) Open the two outside plastic drain screws on the Carver heater (off-white plastic balanced-flue device about halfway along the driver's side of the van). The top, small screw does not come out and only needs (from memory) a half a turn, the bottom screw is much larger and does come out.

4) When all the water has run out, blow through the shower hose to make sure that you have got it all out. Make 100% sure that the van is level, or better still tilted to the driver's side. If all the water is not out, there is a good risk of water freezing  at the non-return valve which controls the filling of the hot water tank (happened to me). Tilting the van really does help with getting all the water out.

Hi there,

After carrying out Spospe's advice I recommend that you leave ALL of the taps open and take the van out for a drive to swing it round a few corners and get any residual fresh water out.

Also, with regard to the toilet flush water, rather than dismantling things to drain it down all I do is:

o  Pump as much of the water out as possible using the pump (it helps if you do it over a few days to let everything drain down),

o  Mix a hefty dose of concentrated bio laundry liquid (Lidl's Formil) with a litre of water and add it to the tank.

o  Pump the mixture out as per above.

The laundry liquid has anti-freeze properties and after four years here in Skegness we have had no sign of it ever freezing up.

Obviously, if I lived in Scotland I would drain everything down with a vengeance!

Hope this helps.

Best regards,

Hi playtime,

We too have just bought a Duetto, and it has the original handbook plus instruction books for everything, fridge, cooker, water heater, etc.

If you'd like to pm me your email address, I'll do you a copy.

Rod

Spospe wrote:the bottom screw is much larger and does come out.

Be careful not to lose the rubber seal - they drop off easily - and leave the plug (bottom screw) out till you want to refill.

26.02.2004 when I e-mailed similar query to ASOC. Next day I had Charles Trevelyan (never heard of him at the time) from the Service Centre on the phone giving advice and telling me he had put a device in the post (FOC) to insert in the carver drain that would allow the water system to be used but keep water out of the heater.

Peter Brown wrote:

26.02.2004 when I e-mailed similar query to ASOC.  Next day I had Charles Trevelyan (never heard of him at the time) from the Service Centre on the phone giving advice and telling me he had put a device in the post (FOC) to insert in the carver drain that would allow the water system to be used but keep water out of the heater.

This device was just a metal rod, which could be inserted through the lower drain hole and in effect blank-off the water heater. It was secured in position by replacing the large plastic drain screw which trapped it against the fill hole for the hot water tank. As Peter Brown says, the idea was that the cold water part of the system could then be used without having to fill the hot water part. This made sub-zero use of the van easier, in that there was no chance of the water heater suffering a freeze-up if things were allowed to get cold. The metal rod was a standard part of Duettos, it was not an optional extra, so if you have a Duetto on a MK4 or MK5 Transit and you do not have this rod, then somewhere along the line, a previous owner has been and gone and lost it for you.

Hi all,    
   This is my first post since joining, and as a newbie I have read most of the posts, all really interesting. 


    Achilles heel    Though not "wintering the van" - it is used daily, am very interested in a copy of the handbook if possible as I am still working out what does what. Would this be possible? Any cost involved please let me know.

timpam1 wrote: am very interested in a copy of the handbook if possible as I am still working out what does what. Would this be possible? Any cost involved please let me know.

Hi Timpam

There used to be pdf downloads of the manuals from Autosleepers.

Don't know if they are still available but it would be worth a look.

I know the A/S Owners Club can provide some, but you have to be a member. Could be worth the £20 to join?? They have one for a 1996 Duetto if that's any good.

Dave

Ta will try both, many thanks.


Tim

Spospe wrote:

Peter Brown wrote:

26.02.2004 when I e-mailed similar query to ASOC.  Next day I had Charles Trevelyan (never heard of him at the time) from the Service Centre on the phone giving advice and telling me he had put a device in the post (FOC) to insert in the carver drain that would allow the water system to be used but keep water out of the heater.

This device was just a metal rod, which could be inserted through the lower drain hole and in effect blank-off the water heater. It was secured in position by replacing the large plastic drain screw which trapped it against the fill hole for the hot water tank. As Peter Brown says, the idea was that the cold water part of the system could then be used without having to fill the hot water part. This made sub-zero use of the van easier, in that there was no chance of the water heater suffering a freeze-up if things were allowed to get cold. The metal rod was a standard part of Duettos, it was not an optional extra, so if you have a Duetto on a MK4 or MK5 Transit and you do not have this rod, then somewhere along the line, a previous owner has been and gone and lost it for you.

Like most owners, mine was missing from my van but fortunately a friend who also had a Duetto had the plug with so i used his and got an engineering friend with access to plenty of metal and various lathes to knock me one up. They are simple enough as can be seen by the photo. It just has a small 'step' in the bar. A poster on here also knocked some out in nylon and sent me one FOC so i now have two.....which i keep stored in my van! Quite why folk keep removing things and then not putting them back is beyond me and really annoying but dealers are also culprits of this too.

A/S used to put them in new vans but stopped some time ago and don't have any left now.

Please could you provide dimensions of the rod as shown please?

As I may have said previously, for me key to getting the water out is to remove the shower head, open hot and cold taps in turn, and blow down the pipe until water stops coming from each of the taps (open/close them individually) and out of the main drain on the Carver Cascade heater. Blowing with your mouth is not without its risks, bursting a blood vessel for example. So having a compressed air supply available in the garage I regulate the pressure down to 20 - 30 psi (i.e. within the pressure rating of the water pump) then apply this with an imperfect seal to the shower head. This clears water much quicker without turning yourself inside out in the process. But don't over pressurise the system!

Bartfarst

Bartfarst wrote:Please could you provide dimensions of the rod as shown please?

As I may have said previously, for me key to getting the water out is to remove the shower head, open hot and cold taps in turn, and blow down the pipe until water stops coming from each of the taps (open/close them individually) and out of the main drain on the Carver Cascade heater. Blowing with your mouth is not without its risks, bursting a blood vessel for example. So having a compressed air supply available in the garage I regulate the pressure down to 20 - 30 psi (i.e. within the pressure rating of the water pump) then apply this with an imperfect seal to the shower head. This clears water much quicker without turning yourself inside out in the process. But don't over pressurise the system!

Bartfarst

Bar is 90mm long, 10mm diam at thick end and 9mm diam at thin end. The 'step down' to 9mm is 60mm along the bar making the 'thinner' end 30mm long.

Personally i wouldn't worry too much over trying to get every last drop of water out! I empty the fresh water tank and remove the drain plug to the heater. I then use the pump to shoot whats left but only in short on/off bursts (don't over run the pump) first with the tap to hot, then cold. I leave that tap open throughout winter. In the shower i open all taps and leave those open. I remove the shower head entirely as 1) they are plastic and 2) cost silly money for a replacement. I then drain off the toilet and grey water tank.

I drive around for a few days with the Carver drain plug out so any residual water has chance to drip out though there usually isn't any. Whatever miniscule droplets of water may be left within the system, has plenty of room and is not going to do any damage.

Thanks Bulletguy.

I'll be turning my own version of the rod shortly.

Agreed: you'll never get all the water out, but the compressed air trick helps shift the vast majority for sure.

Rather than leave the Carver drain plug out for part or all of the winter period, what I do is return the plug part way so that water can still get around the O-ring and thread. Then I apply a small piece of electrical tape across the drain to stop the plug unwinding further. In that way I believe water can still seep out, but bugs and cold air can't get inside the heater. It might be a bit OCD, but then that's me!

Bartfarst

On my last Cascade water heater it was basically impossible to lose the draiin plug as the threaded pard was in two section. You turned it until it went all loose and the water pouring out then if you wanted it out completely you simply pulled it out until the second part of the thread made contact then screwed it all the way...Think they are a bit pricey for a bit of plastic.....

 Just checking the forum on Saturday as the first flurries of snow was falling and a nasty thought came upon me. I forgot all about draining the van for winter. :blushes:Like every one else all the taps are left open and the shower head is left loose. Pump run until the system is as empty as possible.
We have only had frosty problems once. March in Norfolk, the filter on the pump split !!.
We use the van for days out in the winter so the water container for brewing up and watering muttly up is enough.

Bartfarst wrote:Thanks Bulletguy.

I'll be turning my own version of the rod shortly.

Agreed: you'll never get all the water out, but the compressed air trick helps shift the vast majority for sure.

Glad to be of help. 

If you just remove the plug entirely then drive around a bit, after a few corners what bit of water is left will find it's way out. Any residual will purely be droplets which can't do any damage at all and eventually evaporate anyway. After a couple of days i simply screw the plug back in.

redturner37 wrote:On my last Cascade water heater it was basically impossible to lose the draiin plug as the threaded pard was in two section. You turned it until it went all loose and the water pouring out then if you wanted it out completely you simply pulled it out until the second part of the thread made contact then screwed it all the way...Think they are a bit pricey for a bit of plastic.....

Couldn't agree more......hence the reason i remove the shower head entirely and keep it inside the house over winter. Mine is one of these [You must be registered and logged in to see this link.] which for a piece of plastic is absolutely crazy money, but if you shop around as i did, they can be found for half that cost.

redturner37 wrote:On my last Cascade water heater it was basically impossible to lose the draiin plug as the threaded pard was in two section. You turned it until it went all loose and the water pouring out then if you wanted it out completely you simply pulled it out until the second part of the thread made contact then screwed it all the way...Think they are a bit pricey for a bit of plastic.....

Agreed, but on my twenty year old plug the plastic 'tangs' providing the retaining function have long since lost their strength and the unretained plug drops out as easy as anything.

Bartfarst

Gromit wrote:

timpam1 wrote: am very interested in a copy of the handbook if possible as I am still working out what does what. Would this be possible? Any cost involved please let me know.

Hi Timpam

There used to be pdf downloads of the manuals from Autosleepers.

Don't know if they are still available but it would be worth a look.

I know the A/S Owners Club can provide some, but you have to be a member. Could be worth the £20 to join?? They have one for a 1996 Duetto if that's any good.

Dave

This site may have what you want.
[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.]

Bulletguy wrote:

redturner37 wrote:On my last Cascade water heater it was basically impossible to lose the draiin plug as the threaded pard was in two section. You turned it until it went all loose and the water pouring out then if you wanted it out completely you simply pulled it out until the second part of the thread made contact then screwed it all the way...Think they are a bit pricey for a bit of plastic.....

Couldn't agree more......hence the reason i remove the shower head entirely and keep it inside the house over winter. Mine is one of these [You must be registered and logged in to see this link.] which for a piece of plastic is absolutely crazy money, but if you shop around as i did, they can be found for half that cost.

ha ha, mine is not quite as posh as that but only cost me a tenner. Great for my 30 second showers

redturner37 wrote:

Bulletguy wrote:

redturner37 wrote:On my last Cascade water heater it was basically impossible to lose the draiin plug as the threaded pard was in two section. You turned it until it went all loose and the water pouring out then if you wanted it out completely you simply pulled it out until the second part of the thread made contact then screwed it all the way...Think they are a bit pricey for a bit of plastic.....

Couldn't agree more......hence the reason i remove the shower head entirely and keep it inside the house over winter. Mine is one of these [You must be registered and logged in to see this link.] which for a piece of plastic is absolutely crazy money, but if you shop around as i did, they can be found for half that cost.

ha ha, mine is not quite as posh as that but only cost me a tenner. Great for my 30 second showers

Going off topic a bit but the overpricing of anything with 'motorhome' or worse still 'boat' in it's description is something I've mentioned before. With regard to trigger shower heads, instead of searching Ebay for exactly that, try 'shattaf shower head' and you'll find the same item at around half the price including the hose....

[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.]
hash=item1c3dea862b:g:IlEAAOSwT5tWLfzO

Paulmold wrote:

redturner37 wrote:

Bulletguy wrote:

redturner37 wrote:On my last Cascade water heater it was basically impossible to lose the draiin plug as the threaded pard was in two section. You turned it until it went all loose and the water pouring out then if you wanted it out completely you simply pulled it out until the second part of the thread made contact then screwed it all the way...Think they are a bit pricey for a bit of plastic.....

Couldn't agree more......hence the reason i remove the shower head entirely and keep it inside the house over winter. Mine is one of these [You must be registered and logged in to see this link.] which for a piece of plastic is absolutely crazy money, but if you shop around as i did, they can be found for half that cost.

ha ha, mine is not quite as posh as that but only cost me a tenner. Great for my 30 second showers

Going off topic a bit but the overpricing of anything with 'motorhome' or worse still 'boat' in it's description is something I've mentioned before. With regard to trigger shower heads, instead of searching Ebay for exactly that, try 'shattaf shower head' and you'll find the same item at around half the price including the hose....

[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.]
hash=item1c3dea862b:g:IlEAAOSwT5tWLfzO

This is true and though i use ebay a fair bit, i often cross compare on certain motorhome related items and this is what i actually paid for that shower head; [You must be registered and logged in to see this link.]

It's actually a Reich so the same make what most other suppliers are selling for twice that amount which is disgraceful. Based in Glasgow i've used this motorhome accessory place a few times as i find his prices extremely competitive and his p&p charges are sensible too. I recently bought a new water pump from him as even with postal charges it still worked out cheaper than i could buy from any local accessory place!

He's a great guy to deal with.....very friendly and i certainly recommend him to anyone. 

I've just bought one from the caravanshop, thanks Bulletguy.

Paul 300358 wrote:I've just bought one from the caravanshop, thanks Bulletguy.

My pleasure to pass the business on. I've bought a fair amount of stuff from there. I see you are just 'down the road' from me too.. ..i live in Madeley and use this Garage here for MOT and any work; [You must be registered and logged in to see this link.]